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The Catholic Bishops oppose the inclusion of Christian nation clause in the draft constitution

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FILE: Catholic Church ordination ordination ceremony
FILE: Catholic Church ordination ordination ceremony

The Catholic bishops of Zambia are opposing a plan to identify Zambia as “a Christian nation” in the preamble to a new proposed constitution.

In explaining their stand, the Bishops said that “a country cannot practice the values and precepts of Christianity by a mere declaration.

This is according to submissions made by the bishops circulated in response to a call for comments on the draft constitution.

“In the preamble, the declaration that Zambia is a Christian nation should be omitted” they stated.

“That is because – explained the Bishops – a Country cannot practice the values and precepts of Christianity, by a mere declaration.

They said the principle of separation between State and Religion must not be lost.

“If Zambia is a multi-religious Country, a fact that was recognized in the preamble of the first draft of the Technical Committee, to say that Zambia is a Christian nation would be in contradiction with this fact,” they submitted.

In other comments, the Catholic bishops objected to language that would allow for the death penalty and for legal abortion.

The Bishops of Zambia hope that the current process of constitutional revision is successful after the previous three unsuccessful attempts to write a new Constitution.

Among other proposals submitted by the Catholic Bishops are on regulations on citizenship and on the exploitation of natural resources of the country.

The Bishops are also opposed to attempts to include an express clause in the on-going Constitution making process supporting abortion.

They said Zambians must respect the sanctity of life.

“We believe that life begins at conception and that has been our position.”

“There is no way the Zambian constitution should support clauses that support abortion, death penalty or mercy killing.”

Currently, the Zambian law supports abortion in specific cases while the death penalty has not been repealed.

editor
editorhttp://www.lusakatimes.com

181 COMMENTS

    • I guess you are catholic too? Well dude, almost 80% of this country’s population is made up of Christians-so who are the you and the bishops to question what they want or do??You don’t expect the the entire country’s Christian population to uphold their values!

  4. Catholic bishops, you are a real let down. Please i wish you could think of Zambia first before anything else. Look at what religious divisions has done to nigeria……….christians and moslems are killing each other. The christain nation clause allows all Zambians to live in harmony with each other regardless of religious affliations. Please pentecoastal leaders, bishops, pastors, we have work to do……let us fight for this clause to be maintained. Surely it has not done any harm to anyone, why should we abolish it?

    • Manbala, you are very right. Zambia being declered as a Christian nation has done more good than harm. Atleast, we even weigh what to be done in a christian nation. we are not perfect but we strive so hard to live christ like. We will soon know the motives of these unreasonable bishops. GOD help us

    • It is actually the Christian nation clause that will bring about the moslem-christian tension in Zambia 50, 60 or 100 years from now. And you should also be live to the situation that a lot of Zambians 200 years from now will not believe in God at all…!

    • No Mambala. It is that christian nation clause that can bring divisions. If we just exist as a multi-religious nation, then no one would feel titikishad iwe mambala.

    • Ba Mambala, declaring a nation as christian does not change the different beliefs people have as regards religion. It also does not turn murderers into angels, thieves into upright people or create jobs! We have to work at and for peace, put in place systems that uphold human dignity (and these can be done anywhere!).

    • Mambala, you clearly don’t understand the implication of declaring Zambia a christian Nation. If that where to happen all the Mosques and other worshiping places for non-christian groups they will immediately be illegal. So what about the Zambians that all Muslims, Jews, Bahais etc. what will they do? and what about their rights as Zambians?…The bottom line is it will bring more division among us.The fight between Muslims will start in zambia……. 

    • Get an education and you will realise that what is being said by the Bishops is the right thing for the sake of peace and our children’s future! Ba Pente MWALI KWATA PROBLEM! Keep practicising your christianity but dont force all of us to part of your craziness! There’s always problems in country that are governed on the basis of religion! look at the middle east! Respect and Tolerance is important, One Zambia One Nation! What do you need to fight for? Nothing! Dont bring the TB Joshua craziness to Zambia!

      1

  6. Ok. We saw this one coming when these Bishop Fathers where appointed to be part of the draft constitution. We have not seen anything yet. Ok what about “a Catholic/Katolika nation?”

    • They offer a valid opinion because unlike Pente Pastors they actually have a proper education and can understand the difference between religious and state matters! ABASH TB JOSHUA tendancies! 

  7. 1.IT IS TRUE THAT CHRISTINITY SHOULD BE PRACTICED NOT BUT DECLARATION BUT PRACTICE STARTS FROM WHAT YOU DECLARE. COZ OUT OF THE ABUNDANCE OF THE HEART. IF YOU WANT GO TO SAUDI ARABIA. 
    2.DEATH PENALTY IS NECESSARY WHERE IT IS PROVEN THAT A THIEF/THIEVES COMES WITH A GUN, SHOOTS AND KILLS ONE OF YOU , RAPES YOUR WIFE AND/OR DAUGHTERS ETC AND GET YOU PROPERTY AT GUN POINT.
    IN CHINA WHERE THERE IS PROGRESS , YOU CAN EVEN BE KILLED FOR DRUG TRAFFICKING.

    • Saudi Arabia is a terrible example because it is a monarch, not a democratic state, a monarch meaning it is a kingdom. China’s progress has very little to do with human rights. If you insist on using China as a “progressive” example, dig this: China is not a christian/religious state.

  8. I think the catholic bishops are using logic here in their argument of not supporting the inclusione of that clause of declaring Zambia as a christian nation. It would be totally a contradiction, illogical and luck of seriousness in what we declare. Christian principles donot support death penalty and abortion. And here the preamble states: we declare Zambia as a christian nation. And as a christian nation we allow death penalty and abortion. what an illogical thinking!

  9. I have always been against the declaration of Zambia as a christian nation and I agree with the Bishops entirely. It is only fanatical born again christians like Mambala who can not even defend it properly, troubles in Nigeria is due to religious intolerance and declaring a nationa as chrstian when there are other religions does exactly that, promote tension and intolerance. The need to separate State from the Church is cardinal in any society and failure to do that is a recipe for disaster. One does not need a constitutional provision in order to worship God, so dear Born Again Christians, for once, use logic, sense and reasoning as oppossed to emotions and tantrums!!

    • Thank you! People like chi mambala need to get schooled! ba pente naba shupa mu Zambia, anyone with a bible starts to declare that they have a church! One Zambia One Nation! Twakana division by declaration of Zambia as a Christian Nation! 

    • Mpinganjira Zeb you’re the first person I’ve come across who actually sounds like he suses his brain. Most braindead religious fanatical Zambians are so full of it!

  10. Problem with these Catholic Bishops is that they are not spiritual. Too much canality in them. They dont know the spiritual significance of a declaration.

    • ati spiritual, kindly elaborate? these people are right and we all know it! we dont want pente craziness and confusion in our country! keep spiritual matters out of state matters! unlike pente pastors these guys know the difference between religion and state matters! go get an education and understand the real implications of declaring Zambia a christian nation, One Zambia One Nation! No religion should be more important than another! ABASH DIVISION!

  11. Zambia declared is great thing in physical as well as spiritual.I can not understand why someone can be oppose that especially if you preach the GOSPEL.This clause to find a close relationship with GOD.Please bishops support it do not oppose it and GOD will bless you all.

  12. Is it that difficult to see there is a contradiction in declaring Zambia as a christian nation and at the same time saying Zambia is a multi religion nation and upholds freedom of worship ( of any religion) ?

    • Not really insane bishops. Actually, level headed bishops who realize that they have no right to impose their faith on other people.

  14. The man who declared Zambia a christian nation did not consult. He was in the habit of grabbing other people’s wives and had possesed so many anti christian values. The Bishops are correct on this particular one, indeed “a country cannot practice the values and precepts of Christianity by a mere declaration”. In the holy land were Jesus was born there has never been such declarations. Lets not pretend!!!

  16. Sherry,

    You need some more reasoning to convince the Bishops, these are men who have studied theology and were not ordained by themselves in some backyard church to run their church as a business venture! They know what they are talking about, it is as absurd as it is dangerous. Before long, you will be asking everyone to conduct themselves in a christian manner in public life, am sure you think that is ok, but that is what Sharia is in Islam!!! Religion is a very private matter, do it yourself and your family and leave the State to regulate public life, including that of all other religious faith, without discriminating or elevating one above the other!!

    • The catholic is the biggest business venture for you own information. These guys do not want the declaration because it puts Christ above their church. If you were to propose that Zambia be declared a Pope countries, they would the first to agree. Where it is true that mere declaration does not make every in the country Christian, it a show of gratitude to God and opens the country to His blessing. If you what to see how removing declaration does to a country, look at the States. It is now a shadow of its former self living on borrowed money, high crime rates, satanism everywhare 

  17. There is no need of that clause really, and what are Christians so afraid of that they should take to the constitution to defend there beliefs?

  18. BISHOPS FROM WHERE, HELL BOUND? NO WAY, THEY ARE PUNCH DRUNK WITH VINYU. JUST IGNORE THEM, THEY ARE NOT CHRISTIANS, THEY HAVE HIDDEN AGENDAS OF THEIR MASTER,SATAn

  19. Well put Bishop…. Religion should not be forced on the whole country. And as we all know Zambia is a massive country with a lot of religions, so fully declaring Zambia as a “Christian Nation” will mean that we will have to do away with non christian religious practices i.e Muslims, hindu, etc who are required not to work on a certain day or them wearing a certain outfit, etc

    • @Police state….and you as a Christian should be practicing your belief which includes accepting all. You have already mentioned them and you are not them but christian so i don’t expect you to be doing as the non Christians have done. Accept all and those that see good in you will follow by their own will.

  20. Ala imwe ba Catholika what devil has come over you?we have been living in peace all this while and now you want to invite the devil in to our country.am sure there are alot of developmental issues to which you can contribute constructively.the declaration does not affect your life in any way so why is it bothering you.get back to your Bibles and ask God to speak to you.

  21. Declaration of a nation as a democracy does not mean it practices democracy but countries all over the world do…therefore declaring Zambia as a christian nation just means we aspire to be christian. Nothing wrong with aspirations unless you do not beleive in it…are catholics not christian???

    • Aspiring to be a christian is a personal choice, not a national choice, and definitely not by a declaration made by a thief. Morality exists without religion, and so does spirituality.

    • Your silogism of one premise does not allow u to make a conclusion. you have a wobbly base that will lead u to palacious thought. Read new logic books. I urge u to keep quiet

  22. Yaba. Ine naishima fye matthew 4 vs 10. mu bible. awe ba KATOLIKA u shall bring anurgument with the pentecostal which shall never end.

  23. kosadabwa!When you do a study of the catholic “church” you will realise that its not a church but a club.There is a lot of junk behind the scenes that if its members knew most of them would not want to be associated with it.That is why they tried to keep millingo because at his level he knew too much.

  24. Interesting, by this are the Catholic Bishops letting us know that being a Christian and a Catholic are two different things. I thought you are a christian from the Catholic, UCZ, Evangelical church etc. One body different parts. And Christianity is not an automatic thing. You transform daily as you apply yourself to God.
    Anyway this confusion is as a result of differing definition of a Christian. Tiyeni ti funse mwine Christu.

  25. Jesus never forced anyone to be Christian so why should we force religion on a whole nation. People should have the freedom to choose. As Christians lets practice what we preach please!

  26. I doubt that those arguing against the learned Bishops posses even half of their understanding of the Christian doctrine!
    There are well founded reasons for keeping religion and state separate…least of which is the corrupting influence and self serving nature of those who run the state. Religion should not allow these state actors to hi-jack it, pollute it with their filth and turn it into an instrument of state! Equally, the men of the cloth should not hi-jack state politics and apparatus to propel their personal agenda in the name of religion.

    • This has been rightly said man. church and state should be left separate. Christ himself said give to Ceaser what belongs to Ceaser and give God what is due to him. Many evils in history have been perpetrated due to political leaders hijacking the ideologies of religion. One just has to study the history of the catholic church during the dark ages period between AD 476 and 1767 where the pope had hijacked the powers of the state and Rome ruled the earth with an iron first. Then you will understand the need to separate the two
      Religious intolerance will always exist when one form of religion is legilated above the others. Case in point is the muslim world where muslim governments are so intolerant of other relions

  27. Next these bishops will be saying homosexual should be allowed.This makes me doubt morallity of some catholic Bishops- just marry like Milingo did.If they dont want this clause,then they should not any where be called christians but a sect that congregates just to worship idols.When God was creating the heavens and the earth he pronounced using the word-‘let there be’and it came to pass.No wonder why they supported Sata(n) to be be in government so that their satanic vices perpetuate the country.

  28. When ‘men of God’ speak against the things of God, know that the end times are near. For who will fight the battle if men of the cloth can not? The ways of the devil must be fought with renewed vigour as he is now using the very insruments that should be pillars of the Christian faith. Indeed, like someone has said, what you declare is what you expect to happen.

  29. ‘Catholic’s are pagans, they prefer to see people embracing evil than good. What’s wrong with Zambia maintaining its Christian nation status-I don’t see any good reason why they are objecting, unless they have hidden agendas’

    • Nick, I am a Zambian, but I am not a christian, and I am not the only one. How about that? I don’t believe in your Jesus in the sky nor do I believe in Mohammed and his 70 virgins. You are right that catholicism incorporated pagan elements, but what does that say about christianity, since catholicism is the mother of modern christianity? If you do christmas and easter then you’re also practicing pagan worship.

    • Dude, this is a democratic country where the majority’s opinion prevails. No one really cares if you don’t believe in Christianity or not. What matters most is the majorities interest!

    • wtf, who needs their opinion anyway.This is worst corporation/investment ever!, why should this multinational business be allowed to decide for Zambians??? 

    • iwe God will only help those who act not just calling for help whilst seated pa kapuna mwana. stand up for zambia iwe.

  31. I totally Object the Bishops’ narratives that ”…principle of separation between State and Religion must not be lost”.

    The Church and the state shall be total separate institutions, So much harm has be done in the name of the church(Catholic and many others). Look at the abuses in traditionally catholic strong hold nations like Republic of Ireland, Spain and many dioceses in the USA and beyond… and the states there, were chief defenders of the these churches!! The same churches then sent notorious priest offenders to Africa ( and one wonders about their abuses degree there).
    NO MIXING OF THE TWO INSTITUTIONS , NOT IN THIS DAY AND AGE ( grow up Zambia, a white priest/father is not God. these same priests abuses alcohol, you go to Ireland and see it for yourself).

  32. They are pagans, what more can we expect of this profit driven corporation (catholic).

    -all roads lead to rome indeed-

  33. NOW I AGREE TO WHAT MY FATHER USED TO TELL ME AS A CHILD THAT ‘CATHOLICS ARE NOT GENUINE CHRISTIANS, THEY ARE FORNICATORS WHO PRETEND THAT THEY CANNOT MARRY BECAUSE THEY HAVE MADE SOME VOWS’. FOR YOUR INFORMATION YOU CATHOLIC PRETENDERS, THE DECLARATION IS THE SAME AS A COVENANT THAT THIS COUNTRY HAS MADE WITH OUR MAKER. SO YOU WANT US TO DECLARE THIS COUNTRY AS A MUSLIN NATION?

    • The bishops have come out with their own logical thought on the clause in the constitution.
      The clause as it stands does not add any value to the constitution of Zambia, apart from contradicting many other articles in the constitution.
      It should be left out and no one will miss it.
      Any religion worth what it preaches does not need secular states to prop it up. Let the preaching be done in churches, where listeners go out of their own choice. Support disguised theocracy will not help the church here in Zambia. The bishops know they can catch their own fish in church and not through the constitution. May they continue preaching peace and not foster divisions.

    • says the perfect christian, am sure u are christ himself! abash pentecostal fanaticism! this is what watching too much Emmanuel tv brings about! separate state matters from religion! practice your christianity as u see fit just dont force the rest of us! uninformed and uneducated pentes! Theres no need to make a covenant on the nations behalf! do it in ur heart as christianity is a relationship between you and God!

  34. Any way they(romans) killed Jesus can they spare your constitution…? A so called “christian” institution that opposes its own values and morals, what a contradiction. they would rather people be moslem or eartheist than what they proclaim…….? who are these characters really and how are they misleading the masses in theor robes…../ open your eyes people.

  35. these bishops belong to a religious sect as a result they no nothing about Christ the Lord. From the beginning they reject the declaration, so its not the first time and am not surprised. they do not know Jesus Christ but they know papa wa ku rome empela.

    • The Bob Marley who’s name you’re using actually sang in one of his songs, and I quote, “I feel like bombing a church, now that you know the preacher is lying”. He did not say I feel like bombing a catholic church. He said “a church”. That means he burnt the church, so don’t you find it self contradictory to use the name of Bob Marley the great and defend what Bob Marley, the rastaman, stood against? 

  37. It is a pity to note that persons who are bishops for that matter do not understand the spiritual impact the declaration of Zambia as Christian nation will have on the nation and its people.One wonders whether these Bishops are led by the spirit of the living God.

  39. Other countries have declared themselves Islamic states.What wrong with Zambia doing a similar thing ? The bishops argument is lame if only i can say the least.Just because some individuals are not following the christian principles doesn`t mean everyone is.

    • Just because other countries choose to be blinded does not mean we should also accept being blinded. This argument of saying so-and-so did that so it justifies our doing this is lame. How about using your own common sense? Have you heard of how non-muslims are treated in those countries? Is that what you wish to do to non-christians? And, whenever someone says “christians”, why do you have to say muslims? Some of us are neither christian nor muslim and are opposed to both very passionately.

  40. Remember mathew 7vs21, these people represent the kingdom of the devil as bishops and do the work of the devil and that is the reason why they are opposing our Heavenly father`s work what else can we say?their kingdom is in rome and not in paradise wa mushilo that Jesus will reign.

  42. This is total hypocrisy by the so called bishops. What is wrong with Zambia being decalred a Christian Nation? Can we also be told why these bishops have faught so hard over the years agains the Christian declaration? What are they afraid of if what they claim to preach is the Gospel? Do they have hidden agendas? These are pertinent questions they need to answer. The problem is that these bishops thrive in a more liberal environment that condones evil because they are usually the originators of the same. They secretely finance terorism, homosexuality, and all the other eveil vices you can think of. The talk about them being against abortion is laughable. Who doesn’t know what happens in these convents and nanaries? Please spare us the nonsense. Zambia shall remain a Christian Nation.

  43. “They said the principle of separation between State and Religion must not be lost” and yet these fake Christians meddle and interfere in the management of the state. What hypocrisy!! It’s like a snake trying to swallow itself. 

  44. I support the Bishops. Zambia has never been a Christian nation. A mere declaration, verbal or written, without the necessary graces of the Spirit amounts only to noisy gong lip service. Let there be separation between Church and State – let not the State create religion for the people.

  45. Christian fanaticism is on the rise in Zambia. That is why we can’t appreciate sober minds that point out the truth. First of all, Zambians should understand that the constitution is for all Zambians whether Christian, Hindu, Muslim, Atheist or otherwise. By inserting the Christian nation clause in the preamble, you defeat the very purpose of this. If the constitution promotes equality of all, why should it give preference to Christianity only? Why should other beliefs be under its shadow?
    Christians must also learn from Jesus. He tolerated everyone even those who hated him. Besides, he never forced his beliefs on others but offered each one opportunity to decide. Why do we want to preach intolerance and force others to accept our religion? This is hypocrisy of the highest degree.

  46. The Bible tells me that “write down your vision so that whoever sees it will read and run with it” It must be predeclared that ZAMBIA IS A CHRISTIAN NATION. They are bishops, therefore they should follow what is written.

    • Just hear yourself. “THE BIBLE TELLS ME”. Is the constitution yours alone? I am sure you read the Bible wrongly because you sound selfish. 

  47. Let us be judged by our deeds……
    Making declarations or proclamations on a roof-top does not make you a christian.Even merely carrying a bible in the hand doe’s not either.
    You also need to understand that F.T.J Chiluba’s motives for declaring Zambia a Christan Nation were far more political than religious.The game plan was simple…..paint your main political rival(K.K at that time) a satanist while branding yourself as a champion of christian values by declaring Zambia a christian nation.End result, all the blind and fanatical “Born Again” will vote for you.Yet F.T.J presided over the most corrupt and murderous government in the history of Zambia as we later found out.
    I’m not Catholic but the Bishops are very right and have advanced good reasons to substantiate their claims

  50. i would say putting christian nation clause in our constitution it will be wrong, Zambia is a free country which has been re-defined by democratic values, if we only choose one religon to be on our constitution then we are being unfair to other prominent religons which are equally define our society.Christianity is not a name we are given but christianity is our deeds which gives to a name.

  51. Ba katolika nabo? when you hear sata commenting on this topic in line with the bishops, then know that the end is high. they dont mean any gud who are called the katolics. ubuchende bwafula behind those robes.

  54. The Christian Nation thing was just a strategy by FJT to tame Zambians as he rules them forever in the name of “christian nation”. It adds no value really.

  55. The Zambian Catholic Bishops’ view on the declaration of Zambia as a “Christian nation” makes sense, but I disagree with their views on abortion.
    Abortions must be allowed if a woman is raped or her life is in danger during pregnancy. It must also be carried out when conception is by incest

  56. THIS JUST YET A DIVERGENT VIEW.BE TOLERANT TO THIS VIEW IF YOU ARE A DEMOCRAT ,IF YOU ARE A DICTATOR, YOU SHALL CURSE AND INSULT THIS VIEW.THIS YOUR TESTING POINT BWANA.WITH A CONSTITUTION WHICH IS NATIONAL BASED, RESULTING DIVERGENT VIEW IS THE CORNERSTONE WHICH WILL BUILD YOUR CONSTITUTION TO THE POINT WHERE IT WILL BEAT THE TEST OF TIME.REMEMBER THIS IS CONSTITUTION MAKING AND NOT MAKING LAWS.THE DIFFERENCE IS CONSTITUTION MAKING CALLS FOR DEBATE AND CONSULTATION WHILE LAW MAKING IS SOMETIMES ONE CAN USE A STATUTORY INSTRUMENT TO FORCE OTHERS TO ACCEPT.EG THE QUESTION OF MINIMUM WAGE AND SHAMENDA .ALLOW THE CATHOLIC TO EXPRESS THEMSELVES IN THIS MATTER.

  57. #Kadansa – Your generalisation is too shallow and I think I know who you are. It seems the village will never leave you no matter where you are or your level of education. Shame on you mate.

    • @ Mutale this Kadansa is trully shallow. I bet he has realsied how stupid he is by bringing tribalism in serious national matters. That is the reason why they will never rule this country!

  58. Mawilo, appreciated dear, Now Biggie, are you saying that before this clause was inserted in our constitution in 1996 we had pornography, gay marriage and satanism in Zambia??? Now we have this clause in the constitution, some named Pastors are alleged to have killed a beautiful young girl and did unspeakable things to her body, is that because of or inspite of the declaration??? Come one, let us think with our heads and not hearts!! The declaration is completely immarteral and has never changed nor will it ever change anything in the way Zambians live and worship in their different ways!!! The Bishops are dead right and only eccentric religious fanatics will oppose it!!!!

  59. Catholic Bishops, please give us a break… We’ve lived with this declaration for the past 21 years, can you please tell us whose rights have been violated or which religious grouping have been prevented from practicing. I think there are more pressing issues to talk about right now including the deportation of that priest. The declaration is here to stay, please do not dare God. Good luck.
    We say, Zambia is a democratic state….. If we were to delve into this topic, there’s very little democracy on the ground. These bishops should come out in the open and tell us whose interests they are pushing. Doesn’t this explain why that constitution committee is biased on the catholic side in terms of representation?

  61. Thats fine. We can be Christians but we do not need cosmetic legislation to send us to sleep while crooks rampage. Religion is personal. See what is being done in the name of religion in many parts of the world. Watch the fighting in Syria and ask someone to interpret for you what those fighters are shouting each time they fire a bullet to murder another person. That is what institutionalized religion can do. What is happening in South East Asia (Myammar, Bangledesh ) etc because of religion?. In South and Central America, was it not the Christian fundamenatlists who formed death squads to kill the poor who were fighting for their land risghts?. Learn from history folks. The Catholic church even with its many shortfalls has been around for long and they have seen it all before.

  62. “Among other proposals submitted by the Catholic Bishops are on regulations on citizenship and on the exploitation of natural resources of the country”. BUT THIS IS A POLITICAL STATEMENT

  63. You may call Catholic Bishops all sorts of names but the truth stands out. For 21 years, we have lived with the declaration alongside with MMD, a very corrupt regime. Even Kaunda, who never declared Zambia a Christian nation was far better than a crook who did the declaration. Over the 21 years, there was so much corruption that we still don’t have direction as a country 47 years after Independence. Over the 21 years, wife battering, defilement of minors and adults (even by some of the pastors), murders (even by pastors) have exceeded accepted proportions. So, if we have lived with the declaration for 21 years, its either God has not recognized it to protect us or the declaration is a non-starter which means nothing but ink on a paper or words on the mouths of Christian fanatics.

  64. the sooner people realise that god is a myth and religion is the most divisive thing in the world, the better life will be.

  65. The bishops just want to legalise theft and debauchery that PF have started.  These Bemba thieves are slimy creatures indeed!

  66. Why has this become an issue now? Why do we want to depart from something we believed to have been best for our country for 21 years? Lord help us. We cry to you Lord.

  67. Catholic Bishops are not Christians therefore, it is not surprising that they are opposing Christ! They have always opposed Christ. They opposed him to the point of passing a death sentence on Him, this is nothing new, READ YOUR BIBLE. Zambians should open their eyes. The Christian nation clause has been in the constitution for over 20 years, what is it that they can tell us now? We refuse to call our nation a catholic nation. We are a Christian nation and we shall remain a Christian nation. If the devil attempts to alter the constitution, we shall fight the devil out and restore the nation. This is a spiritual battle and Christians should not just blog but pray and fast about it. Ever since Zambia was declared a Christian nation, the devil has been spending sleepless nights. 

  68. Hello it is sad that this statements it is even coming from the so-called catholic bishop they are a total let down Zambia is for JESUS CHRIST remember who are we without the LORD,though we have wicknesses but we have to be taught by the LORD and then we can live right…No Satanist or Devil can take JESUS CHRIST away from the Zambian people

  69. It is time to pray for Zambia and any christian who voted for this government needs to repent seriously.

  70. Cont’d …The presidential powers should only go as far forming a cabinet, leaving appointments and promotion of service chiefs to their respective professional bodies in conjunction with the public service commission. Permanent secretaries should be career civil servant whose appointments and promotion must be left to the civil service commission. This will ensure continuity in all civic and areas of governance in the absence of a meaningful government as is the case today. Catholic Bishops must channel their energy to ensuring
    they worship God in an environment free of fear of deportation, persecution and all other forms of political interference. I thought they learnt from past mistakes like discouraging the use of condoms which they interpreted as encouraging sex.

    • We Catholics are not a closed society who should be confined only to certain matters. We are not worried when we are persecuted, deported so there is no need of expending our energy on self conservation. Just because one of us has been deported does not mean we should forget about other issues.
      I don’t know where you get the idea that discouraging the use of condoms as a way of preventing immorality has been a mistake on the part of the Catholic Church. Our church has promoted life as can be witnessed by a numbers of hospitals we run throughout the country. The issue on condoms borders on openness to life which every licit sexual intercourse should promote and not just to lessen promiscuity.

  71. GOOD NEWS
    1. I NEVERS MUMBA WAS PREACHING ZAMBIA SHALL BE SAVED ON TV. I WILL BE PRESIDENT VERY SOON AND WILL MAKE SURE THIS CLAUSE IS IN THE CONSTITUTION. YOU WILL ALL BE SAVED. NO THEFT, NO ADULTERY, NO CRIME ALL WILL BE OK UNDER MY CONTROL. GIVE ME A CHANCE.
    2. TB JOSHUA HAS DECLARED NIGERIA AS CHRISTIAN NATION. ALL NIGERIANS HAVE ACCEPTED. CALL HIM TO ZAMBIA AND HE CAN RESOLVE THIS ISSUE ONCE AND FOR ALL.

    • my God, where do you get all these lies? Nigeria a Christian nation? have you heard of North and South Nigeria? do you know Boko Haram and do you know why they are bombing churches? i think you are not well-read. 

  72. I THINK THE CATHOLIC BISHOPS ARE REPRESENTING SATANISTS OR ARE SATANISTS THEMSELVES. OF ALL PEOPLE WHY THE SO CALLED BISHOPS? WHATS WRONG WITH IDENTIFYING OURSELVES WITH JESUS CHRIST? IF YOU DENY JESUS IN THE OPEN WOULD HE ACCEPT YOU CATHOLIC BISHOPS!

  73. LT you have distorted the line of discussion by omitting my first part where the above posting began.My piece doesn’t make much sense anymore.This cannot be right, This is the censorship in public media we do not want, there was nothing wrong in it. Please squeeze it back on.

  75. We are not Catholics but we agree with the bishops on the Christian clause. We do not want the monkey eating bastards running the state to hide behind religion and claim they will rule by the ten commandments, while they steal us blind! Let state and religion be separate.

  76. Sometimes i wonder if these 20,000 or more different christian bibles we “Christians” base our living and faith on. The bible I know surely i.e doesn’t impose Christianity on people and just like Jesus led by example by taking care and giving to the poor and him living a humble and ordinary life but look at our current church leaders how large they live with lavish cars, houses and clothes and still take more and more money from the poor in the name of Jesus. How sick and Hypocritical is that. Thats just wrong! How do you convince a non christian to do good when you cant even practice what Jesus requests of you and are always judging others too. Its a shame really!

  80. If the issue is about being democratic, the BIshop have lost it. The MAJORITY Zambians are in favour of the CHRISTIAN NATION DECLARATION. Check your records you bishops and whoever is championing this last minute ambush. This matter is WAY BEYOND FTJs first declaration. It has been endorsed by the majority. Unless the rules of democracy are being bent to soot the new “king makers”. IF IT GOES THAT WAY, EVEN THIS ONE WILL NOT BE ENACTED!!! WATCH THIS SPACE…

  81. Please dont involve christians in your constitution.By doing so u r insulting Christainity.Its called BLASSPHEMY.If this nation was christian than it would never be in the state it is in. Thieves, plunderers, adultreres frequent the church and use the church to their own benefit. They are cheating the people big time. GOOD, The church is RIGHT.

  82. Christianity clause contradicts itself….how can you allow death penalty and abortion in a christian nation? bloggers please…think with your brains and not your hearts.

    • why are you then advocating for the removal of the good. Why not fight to remove death penalty and abortion instead

  83. I KEEP WONDERING WHY SOME OF YOU ARE MORE CHRISTIANS THAT JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF AND PUT THE LANGUAGE IN HIS MOUTH. JESUS EXPLICITLY SAID, MY KINGDOM IS NOT OF THIS WORLD, IF IT WAS OF THIS WORLD MY OWN WILL FIGHT FOR ME. JESUS CAME TO TEACH THE KINGDOM OF GOD, THE POWER OF GOD IN THE LIFE OF PEOPLE. HE WAS NOT INTERESTED IN CREATING A CHRISTENDOM, THAT IS WHY HE ESCAPED TO BE ENTHRONED KING. CHRIST IS ABOVE THE CONSTITUTION OF ANY LAND. WHETHER YOU INCLUDE “CHRISTIAN NATION OF NOT IN THE CONSTITUTION” JESUS CHRIST IS WAY ABOVE THAT. GIVE TO CEASAR WHAT BELONG TO CEASAR AND TO GOD WHAT BELONGS TO GOD. LET THE CONSTITUTION BE INCLUSIVE AND GOVERN ALL WHO UNDER CIVIC LEADERSHIP. LET RELIGION BE BEYOND CIVIC GOVERNANCE, IT GOD’S AUTHORITY OVER HUMANITY.

  84. YouTube if you had seen where this post originated you would have understood that my central point was far from condenming the catholic position on areas you have touched. However, what I find difficult to take is your radicle position on obvious contentious issues such as abortion, use condemns and now a simple statement of declaring of our christianity. We all know that catholicism is an idiology practised in the context of a christain establishment yet there is very little or none of real christain values among its followers on the ground. We can talk of abuse of children in catholic care homes and many other other henious crimes too numerous to list here. This means that there is enough mess in need of cleaning up within the Catholic establishment itself.

  85. I am not catholic, but why so much hate for the Catholics being expressed here. Whenever there is an issue related to the catholic Church, there is so much insult, hatred, demeaning language and calling of names. I am get to understand that they must have a great impact on so many people. Catholics, keep up your Holy work. “Blessed are you when they insult you, say all kinds of calumny about you because of my name….:”

  86. I think the Bisshops have just confirmed my long held views about this declaration and religion in general! when I sit down alone I tend to ponder on all the world conflicts happening in various parts of our globe! and what do I see? You guessed right, most are caused by some religious believe of some kind! Boko Haram, Al shabab, Al Quaida, Norwegian mass killings, Bosian masacre etc. Would it not be better if people just valued each other’s lives other than hating each other purely because one does not belong to your religion?

  87. Zambia has always been a Christian nation and what we are advocating for now is just to have it included in our constitution. People lets open our eyes and deeply reflect on this matter. Declaring Zambia as a Christian nation is not in any way disparaging our brothers and sisters from other faiths, moreover Christian values and tenets are more inclusive and tolerant than any of these other religions you can think of. If you don’t believe me, go and try to practice Christianity in Afghanistan.

  88. Catholics are not Christians in the first place. Its a false religion using Christian as a cover. The reason why UK, USA, Europe, Aus, New Zealand are so blessed is because they were founded on Christian values. I know they don’t save God anymore now (most of them) but that is beside the point. Chiluba was not perfect yes but I believe God worked through him to declare us a Christian state. Look at Haiti, which was dedicated to satan at independence and look at Dominican Republic? Same Island but Haiti always has issues. Born again Christians lets pray hard. 

  89. cont’d. We understand you are not a closed society, but there comes a time when one should re-examine their central role and ask themselves whether it is worth to consistently drift from it. I believe that part of the responsibility of any christian organisation is to try and harmonise conflicting parties in search for a peaceful compromising position and not to inflame it. The catholic bishops are not very different from Sata (CNP) himnself. Loud-mouthed, but absolutely no substance. I can understand why he is tolerated as a eucharist by the catholics despite his promosciouity and multiple affairs.

  90. #1 banoko e ule. You must be a very st.upid and dull person who always want to talk about tribe. Are jealous of Bembas Chi. ka. la?

  91. The problem with fanaticism is that you fail to tolerate divergent views over issues. The catholic bishops have given there own view. Every citizen is free to make your own views. Who is Christian? I want some one to define for me? Jesus himself never defined it? Where does Jesus define who is a Christian?
    Which is the right christian church? I would to know! If you say Catholics are not Christians, who are Christians?

  92. Zambia will remain a christian nation. Whether catholic bishops like it or not. We have been a Christian nation for 20 years and we will continue being so.

  93. And wen u see thez thngs, know that the end tym is near…. We are ruled by Catholics world over! They mix politics and Christianity, remember the person on news who leaked Vatican data?? An American President can never rule without the Pope’s advise/visit, why? They are above the most powerful nation in this world, these are just but a few of the antichristism that u can find in the catholic church – cult. Now Jesus will soon come to separate us, and He will not tally… WATCH AND PRAY!!

  94. I read your reactions guys concerning the matter hand and this has given some insight as to how much we love God in this country. However, I must hasten to tell us that this is a spiritual battle that cannot be won on mere logic, its beyond the statement from the bishops and I there urge every christian to if possible fast for our country so that Christ may reign in the land. We may not be able to the blessings we are enjoying now under this declaration but the consquences of removing it are too bitter to contemplate-license to homosexuality, more murders, empowering muslim extremists etc

  95. WE, THE PEOPLE OF ZAMBIA, IN EXERCISE OF OUR CONSTITUENT POWER:
    ACKNOWLEDGE the supremacy of God Almighty;
    DECLARE the Republic a Christian Nation, but uphold the right of every person to enjoy that person’s freedom of conscience or religion

  96. This is sad …a house divided falls. Moslems are proud to call their nations Moslem state. But it does not make sense when Catholics who are meant to be Christians are not proud to have a country called a Christian state. Do they think Z is not good enough to be associated with the word Christ? They are supposed to be teaching people in Z how to become Christians not discouraging them. Aren’t we told Christianity starts with confession. Salvation pray…Watch talent pa Zed and see how many youths sing Christian songs when auditioning. Compare that to other countries? I do not understand the Catholics from a spiritual point of view on this one. Oh by the way I went to a Catholic school…by God’s grace know the power of the the word Christ. I support Z being called a Christian nation.

  97. These Catholic Bishops are scaring all of us. I noticed this opposition during the Easter celebrations when Bishop Telesphore Mpundu took an onslaught on the declaration. Before elections, removal of this clause from the constitution criculated as one negative PF will undertake when they come into power. 
    Is PF sure of such machinations? Ban KiMoon came to Zambia and Sata was asked to make his stance against HHomosexual and he could not come out clean. So Christians, after the removal of the clause, what next, watch and pray. The Bishops are agents of the devil.

  98. Are we say the declaration should be removed so people should continue with corruption, immorality etc. Let all who support the declaration stand up. The catholics have spoken, We know the stand of the Evangelical Fellowship of Zambia and one of it’s member churches The Petecostal Assemblies of God. We want to Hear from the Council of Churches in Zambia and it’s member churches like the United Church of Zambia (where i belong). Zambia For Jesus. The declaration Must Stand.

  99. pathetic bishops
    the pope wanted european parliament included Christian roots in the constitution but parliamentarians refused
    its the contrary in Zed
    islamic states dont reflect on such subjects. Muslims gain upper the hand because such Christian people are right-thinking loosers !

  100. i even wonder if catholics are christian at all.you watch the satanism in catholic on youtube you will see whats behind it they just hide in christianity to deceive people.

  101. Only two powers exists and every human being is influenced by either of the DARKNESS and LIGHT, The power of good and evil. God almighty can not be compared to Satan. Do not follow blindly. Darkness and light has never worked together. The conscience of every man is fashioned either of these.  The catholic bishops know whom they are serving.

  102. This is the most stupid thing i have ever heard from a spiritual leader, how can we refuse to declare Christ as the head of the nation??, this is like saying one should not be a christian because they have sinned, this is the devil at work.

    The power a declaration has, has got more power than what is seen to the naked eye. Please keep it in, whether we are righteous or we fall short of the glory of God, we still want to fall under our lords wings.

    • Can you imagine, may if it comes from none church people , you can understand . So its clear now that some of these bishops don’t represent Christ

  103. what do you expect from these priests who don’t abide by Christian principles? they are either womernizers or homosexuals. they would be happy for Zambia to be called a Catholic nation than a christian nation. shame on these false prophets.

  106. Common sense must prevail. Christianity in Zambia embraces many Churches which include, among others, Anglican Church, various kinds of Apostolic Churches, Catholic Church, Church of Scotland, Reformed Church of Zambia, United Church of Zambia. It is a puzzle that the Catholic Church are seeking to drive their sole doctrine down the throats of other Churches. The Catholics are posturing as if they are closer to God than the rest of Churches. Yet disgraceful occurrences of immoral acts are emerging from the very seniorCatholic priests. Which version of Christianty is the Catholic Church projecting? If the issue of “Zambia as a Christian Nation” was subjected to a democratic One-Church One-Vote, the non-Catholic Churches would carry the day. Only dictators would reject the peoples wish.

  107. its not surprising to hear that, coz these romans katolikas are fulfilling their anti-christ stance.
    they’re anti-christ from the beginning.

  109. @88 kabwata dallas, who knew about petty, thieving, hypocritical born again christianity when the USA was born? There was only catholicism until dreamers in the name of born again came on thw scene.[-(

  110. This christian thing must never be allowed in our constitution until all born again pastors/bishops stop stealing from poor people, all born again women stop grabing other women husbands and fake christians stop being more evil than satan. In zambia the most evil person is this so called born again christian, ask for help or go into a deal with anyone of these fake christians… be sure to curse the day you were born. Christinity is christ like not these fake zambian christians who are satan like [-(

  111. Bishops are Right about this one !!!!!   Alot of us don’t understand what it means to declare Zambia a christian Nation.
    1. Not all Zambians are Christians
    2. Once done there will be no freedom of worship, which will go against the Human rights which we signed for under the UN – Human rights.
    3. There will be more tension between christians and other religions which means no peace in the country.
    …….So all those saying the bishops are wrong go and research more about the implication of declaring Zambia a christian nation. 

  112. Viva Catholic Bishops! Educated people of God, noti utuma pastor twapa bus!!! we are a diverse nation that allows everyone to practice their religion! For the sake of our childrens future let us not make Zambia a Christian Nation, Look at all the countries that are governed by religion in the middle east, there is one that is common, conflict on religious grounds! Lets be practical, just because you are caught up in Pente fever you should make the rest of us suffer! Practise your religion and dont bother the rest of us! I am catholic and am proud, I dont bother anyone and no one should bother me. Dont turn our country into a sharia like state! One Zambia One Nation! Zambia for all Christians, Hindus, Muslims, Bahais, Traditionalists, Buddhist!!! 

  113. Only satanist are free to oppose Zambia as a Christian nation. Catholics we have come to understand u better. Continue yo game with yo pope but u never succeed. Fake priest satanic oriented. Shame on all the Catholics. Zambia shall remain and will be ever be a Christian Nation.

  114. the GOD whom the catholics worship in truth and faith ll prevail over tu pente(born again) god whose spirit is stealing from the poor.

  115. Christians its time of warfare , lets pray against these satanic plots. The Bishops may be thinking that they are helping people to accommodate each other but we know that even to crucify Jesus, satan entered one of His Apostles. The devil does not change, he is at it again, he has entered the bishops now,to crucify the christian declaration out of our constitution. All the devil doesn’t want is Jesus Christ to be seen as supreme. He has a very big problem with that,so is anyone who follows dead religion. The devil wants to use them to pave way for homosexuality, bring Islam in government hence Boko Arama.

  116. Was my comment deleted? Hmmm Very suspect!!! Don’t call yourself a news publication if other comments are going to be censored.  
     

  117. The bishops needs deliverance,should be emmediately evacuated to Nigeria to be prayed for by TB Joshua. In Zambia we have enjoyed peace from JESUS the bishops want reject .As Zambia we ll not be decieved. Go Zambia Christian Nation.

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