‘We are not children’, Levy

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lpm.JPGPresident Mwanawasa says the West should stop treating African nations as infants who cannot make decisions on their own.

Mr. Mwanawasa said African governments and Zambia in particular are capable of making decisions that are good for their people.

The President also condemned the decision by some opposition parties to champion the cause for Western countries against Chinese investment in Zambia.

He said Europe and the United States import from China and have trade relation with it.

Mr. Mwanawasa said some European countries like the United Kingdom even exceeded their import quotas from China last year.

The President wondered why Chinese investment in Africa was of so much concern to Western Countries.

He was speaking on arrival at Ndola international Airport ahead of his tour of NCF Mine projects in Chambishi.

53 COMMENTS

  1. Ba Levy-Good work and no one should critize you. Ba Easy and kuku where are you? Jose is still on the run. Running away from coruption charges I never see him these days…

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  2. Cyber today is sunday we all go to church. I will not carry ny device with in the lords house. We shall link up later. PLM is right fight debt and you free yourself from the West and their influence. Pay them off. Later later the lord is calling. We are Gods children not like Ba Pastor Nyirongo?

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  3. Congratulation HE Levy P. Mwanawasa. Should should stand firm as a President. We love you all.

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  4. They want to treat you like children because their assistance has strings attached to it. They are too much of the double standards. Although the Chinese assistance has no strings attached to it, all we want is for the Chinese investors to consider motivating the local workforce by paying reasonable wages. They should not be comparing with their country where labour force is so cheap. They should take into consideration the issue of money parity across the globe.

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  5. HELLO.We are children.What can we do by ourselves?We are a mess.Always living on hands out.Now its the chinese.GOD HELP US.

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  6. Its time for the chinese to colonise the Africans.The Europeans thought they had taken everything from this dark continent.
    Iam sure the Chinese will perfect it with the catch phrase”No Strings attached”.All the while the continents resourses will be bled out to the bone.The Africans will still be a poor lot.

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  7. LPM is right but we are only treated as children by the west if we give them a reason to do so. Stand firm Mr President we are behind you and I hope you mean what you say.
    To the Church goers peace be upon you all and those that have other religious beliefs peace be upon you too. For me my region is”LOVE” Love to everyone walking this earth and to those that left this earth and into another form of being. LOVE and PEACE to our beloved holy mother AFRICA.

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  8. Bravo President Mwanawasa! You have my undivided support on the stand you have taken. Folks, African countries must accelerate steps towards integrating their economies — building regional communities, adopting common currencies and increasing trade with each other — and laying the groundwork for the establishment of an African Economic Community, which, like the European Union, could enable them to benefit from larger markets beyond the continent.
    No secret, “Africa’s longstanding recognition of the needs and benefits of regional integration has spawned the proliferation of regional economies and protocols across the continent which the intelligentsia should consider involvement in advocacy beyond here” What is there just need to be strategically consolidated.” Forming a regional trading bloc is seen as Africa’s best chance for promoting sustainable development and becoming a viable trading partner in the global economy.
    Don’t forget that already there 14 regional economic communities — considered the building blocks of the African Economic Community — in addition to a number of bodies like the West African Monetary Institute and the Development Bank of Southern Africa’s Preferential Trade Area, which have been created to support the process. Folks, we can and must shape our own destiny.

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  9. The west have double standards when issues concern china, this is truely anti-imperialist. Compare it with the thief trying to sound anti-imperialist by refusing to go to court.

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  10. LPM has himself to blame by taking civil cases to Europe. For that reason LPM will never be treated as an equal by Europe who he goes to for legal recourse even when Zambian courts are fully functional.

    So please ba LPM stop complaining and continue to press on with the line you earlier took.

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  11. #10 Truly Zambia you are wrong by bringing this issue o´f nation plunderers. The Zambian government took those cases to Bratain on two grounds: Firstly it involves citizen of England, DR Congo, Switzerland and Zambia. Chiluba was acqiured a chance to be tried in his bed room but he refused no wonder his case become of nation and global interest. Daniel Arap Moi of Kenya had similar case like FTJ. He agreed to settle everything out of court. This is what humble leader can do because to rule is not easy you cannot appease everyone. After all everyone makes mistakes in life. Its time to free ourselves from econimical slavery it is over due 800 years is long time. If you can remember I questioned the president on this blog during G8 Summit the 40 pound per year that Zambia was to get from UK, unfortunately Lusaka times removed this article before it was reap for discuss. Its time to wake up and liberate our country from economical imprisonment. Free Zambian economy so LPM is right.

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  12. Two days ago, a friend of mine from a neighbouring country laughed at me when he heard we had taken our former President to a European court! In his mind, it was inconceivable! He asked me if the alleged money was stolen from Britain or from Zambia. If this story were there earlier, I could have told him to ask the children! I think children know best!

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  13. Your neighbour was right because you did not tell him the background. you needed to be sincere that you are talking about a thief.
    If he feels stealing is NOT an offence please move from the neighbourhood, or atleast send your wife away as you decide the way forward.

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  14. Ref#12 – You have raised central issues regarding the plunder of national resources. If the money was stolen from Zambian Banks then Zambian courts should have passed those judgements. It looks bizarre that 3 weeks after the so-called victory Judgement that LPM is now crying foul with Europe. “Muzungu anikonde” attitude will never free Zambians from the economic slavery they are currently experiencing. I’m inviting anyone who knows about 5 black Zambians who are millionaires in ££££££££ or us$$$$$$$$ to tell us on this blog. In turn I will tell you 5 black Zimbabweans running viable businesses worth millions of US$.

    “Every man has a right to determine his own destiny”. (Robert Nesta Marley)

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  15. How much is this Chinese investment worth?Is it more than more than the K1.9 TRILLION these Demagogues have stolen?Let`s be serious with running our country and aim to be self reliant and we can tell anybody to shove it.

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  16. #11 Easy, please check the facts again. The “Bedroom Court” you are talking about was to be remote controlled from a foreign court, i.e. on video. That is the chance that FTJ “refused!”

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  17. The Zambian capacity to investigate the magnitude of FTJ’s theft is simply not there. It would have been very easy to influence the Zambian courts, remember also that FTJ’s medical trips to SA have enabled him to have access to his hidden treasures enabling him to still have influence with certain people! This topic is very different from the “children” reference story, and should be treated as such. Else your analytical minds are in question.

    China is the largest exporter to the USA! The difference of course is that China is getting our raw materials, making goods and exporting to the West.

    When I look at LPM I see someone who may go down as the best president we have ever had. He would have even handled the privatization project wisely avoinding the tiny royalties we are recieving as a nation. Privatization money is the ZAMTROP money!

    Good Job under 20!!!!

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  18. Ck16# I diddnt want to discuss Chiluba again because I feel like vomitng he is the source of these misery here if he had listen to his vice in 1994 that there is rampant corruption today he going to be free man and we as his children we were not going to rise a finger aganist him. The problem Kamudaala was drunk of power and having wrong advisor- God forbid. The west will always rise their eyeblows if anything comes that challenges their interest. Just try to build your own cup or satelite you be doomed and comended. If you can invent medicine that can cure a disease you will be silenced. So we are learning slowly he have to defend ourselves. Guys stop blame the president for this ” we are not children” right now most you dressed in products produced by the west balemufwalika you are their children. Promote Maheu instead of coca cola and you see the product developing. Everything mulefumba yabakubukaya. underwear. Its only sugar you can boost that its Zambian made.

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  19. Kuku plz tell us where ba Joze is?
    #1 if you have info about ba Joze let us know. May be he was Waza.

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  20. I see everyone is busy lauding the chinese ‘no strings attached’ investment forgetting that this is nothing more than a plunder of national resources. Our govt has been falling over itself about the goodness of chinese investment without putting in place rules and regulations that safeguard interests of Zambia. Low wages, poor working condition – virtually no labour framework – in exchange for goods manufactured of our raw materials outside the country. Yes, it is true the western world is importing heavily from China but has anyone of you people ever checked out the quality of goods destined for say Europe and Africa? China cannot export low quality goods because of laws and regulatory frameworks in place in the West, something we do not have. As much as we need foreign investment, there should be standards in the kind of investors we want and in what sectors – chinese or not. Now the chinese with the help of both govts(China&Zed) are in every sector of the economy,no room for locals.

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  21. #19 M´kulupe kuku has also disappeared the last time he contributed on the web was on Friday. I hope police have not picked him for supporting FTJ. He said by to he said was going for a meeting on how traffic conjestion can be attain in Lusaka. That is the last time. You know I have exchanged good views with him but this condemination of ZESCO and INDENI it can have impact on peoples lives all what we want is better service for everyone.

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  22. KC#16 Can you remember that Judge Smith had come to Zambia to sit with Judge Japhet Banda but the complaint refused refused to be tried. LPM offered FTJ to pay back without court trial but the refused. How can we help this man now he saying LPM has more case to answer than him (FTJ). He is the general Auditor in the office of the president. Ka Kalulu.

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  23. I have a suggestion for all Zambians. Since are need are the same like those of the chinese. Can Zambia build a processing industry in CB where finished goods can be prooduced for a local market so that we stop this no string attached sydrome. I believe all Zambians need these goods.

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  24. Both the Chinese and the West do not give for ultruistic reasons. Ok, Chinese money does not have any polical strings attached. However, one drawback is that whatever assets they help build will forever remain in Chinese hands, e.g. Tazara, Mulungushi txt, etc. The other drawback is that they will help prop up dictators and will close their eyes when it comes to corruption. They will not think twice about giving money to MMD. Most African leaders see Chinese money as a quick replacement of the formerly generous loans and handouts from the West and the Soviet block that characterised the cold war era. Already, in countries where there are no opposition parties, such as in Gabon, the presidents and their cronies have virtually handed over vast swaithes of the rain forests to the Chinese and once again Swiss bank accounts are beginning to fill up with dodgy money. After all the Chinese ask no questions. If that is what LPM wants then I would be unconfortable.

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  25. Yes # 22 Easy, I remember that too. I do not want to go back to the FTJ saga as well. I guess I raised the issue now because I felt the West will continue to treat us like children who do not know what to do because of the way we conduct ourselves. You said Judge Smith was going to sit with our Zambian judge and still do not see the reason for my comment? Even if you were a well-qualified MD or lawyer from a prestigious foreign medical school or law school you could not just walk into the U.S. and practice medicine or law. Infarct, it may take you a minimum of three years or you may not even ever practice at all! I do not know about in U.K. Yes, like children they will continue to treat us until we begin to show that we have our own spines.

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  26. Easy and Kuku mwaba so ma help. What about judge smith
    is not british rule in Zambia?Kafupi ati LPM has more cases than me.Is it judge Smith on LPM again? Easy and Kuku help please.Lay country Zambia ya tushupa mwe.

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  27. Zambia is democratic and peace loving nation number one on the continent. So Guys wait for our time to come 2011 we shall rule and reign and do much better because we shall empower the people they will for the first time feel that they are ruling themselves. Over FTJ 26# he can now speak but the law is on him. LPM has not do with him he is in the hands of Judge Banda and Mumba Maila and Police and ACC. If Chibula has an evidence against the incumbant president let him go ahead we clean Zambians all we want is just to be done. We have to get Stella and Chungu because these are the keep witness over plundering. Its unfortunate the court will be very touch on Chiluba when judgement day comes because they would want to show their teéth and save their face. I would advice all bloggers to wait for final judgement.

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  28. Of course we are not children, so let us even learn to do things by ourselves and build descent places to live. When I was in Nairobi, I was impressed with the airport, Jomo Kenyata internat…and those guys are building good many storey buildings for accomodation and business ventures. Their tourism is sound. Its time we started to build infrastructure to serve all sectors of our zedian sosido(society). We can do it, check how many pipo are eager to lay mansions in woodlands extension and other parts of lsk. But then im advocating for something corporate where big enterpreneours can venture into building of flats and all with a good provision for water supply. And zedians be aware of climate change!! Now in eastern europe its raining cats and dogs, which it never did in the past for many years. Brace yourselves for extremes!! Then you will not be treated like children clear!!!

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  29. Mwanawasa doesn’t what he is doing with the so called chinese invested; they are ripping the country off resources because they have few resources in the country due to the high popullation. I agree with the other write who talked about the quality of product the chinese export. For the most part all their products are questionable.Right now in the U.S.A, china exported tooth paste which was laced with other chemicals that can cause death, their pork, beef and some of the cars were off low quality/standards, the U.S.A is always making sure the these people do use their country as a dumping group. In Zambia however we don’t monotor the quality of goods entering our country.I can say that china can not give free money they are getting some benefits. China as a capitalist nation can not just give money like that.The economist say that there is no free lunch because somebody is paying for it in our case our resources. Grow up Zambian leaders we need leaders that are well exposed.

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  30. Mwanawasa doesn’t know what he is doing with the so called chinese investors; they are ripping the country off resources because they have few resources in the country due to the high population. I agree with the other write who talked about the quality of product the chinese export. For the most part all their products are questionable.Right now in the U.S.A, china exported tooth paste which was laced with other chemicals that can cause death, their pork, beef and some of the cars were off low quality/standards, the U.S.A is always making sure the these people do not use their country as a dumping group. In Zambia however we don’t monotor the quality of goods entering our country.I can say that china can not give free money they are getting some benefits. China as a capitalist nation can not just give money like that.The economist say that there is no free lunch because somebody is paying for it in our case our resources. Grow up Zambian leaders we need leaders that are well exposed.

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  31. â„–31 its plain as ABC to realise that China is getting something out of its deal with zed. That is why its called investment!!!

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  32. All Investors look for profit, chinese are no exception. So what zambia needs are good labour laws coupled with good enforcement.
    Chasing investors, will not do good to the economy. Simply stated , you can NOT benefit from copper which is still in the ground, there has to be investment to get it out. Unfortunately this is what eludes cheap politicians like Mr Sata.

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  33. It must be said that the quality of debate on this site is below par, it is like high school students are online chatting. Of course we need to to process our resources into finished product which we can export instead of just selling raw materials. There is need for the manufacturing industry to be revamp in Zambia. To be honest the kind of investment this chinese bring to Zambia will never take us anywhere we need to determine the future of our economy we should never leave to outsiders. No body is calling for chasing these investor; we just have to be in control and not treat them like there are our masters. If Mwanawasa wants he can be their subject but should not the Zambians and the Zambian resources to be taken advantage of by these infestors.

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  34. It must be said that the quality of debate on this site is below par, it is like high school students are online chatting. Of course we need to to process our resources into finished product which we can export instead of just selling raw materials. There is need for the manufacturing industry to be revamp in Zambia. To be honest the kind of investment this chinese bring to Zambia will never take us anywhere we need to determine the future of our economy we should never leave to outsiders. No body is calling for chasing these investor; we just have to be in control and not treat them like there are our masters. If Mwanawasa wants he can be their subject but should not the Zambians and the Zambian resources to be taken advantage of by these infestors.

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  35. This expression by the prez can not pass without comment cause it arouse mixed feelings about who we are and where we are as a pipo.First we have to acknowledge the fact that we are the the ones that are in need.Our national antherm talks about dignity and peace but we all know that there is no dignity in poverty and peace is a commodity that is traded with economical emancipation.If pipo are economically deprived then peace is ellusive.Its a natural instict that human being wants to provide for there off-spring but if you deny them an opportunity they will fight anything in there way or they will take there dignity off just to survive.In zambia we at the cross road where we want to keep our dignity but economical status forbid or just can’t approve.As a result of this mixed feeling we have the prez signing the 40 million pounds from britain aid and turn round and say do not treat us like children.Chinese investment is good but the onus is on us to keep our dignity.

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  36. Tombiza #35,36, I am delighted you rate yourself highly. I think its common sense we need to export more finnished products, BUT obviously this does NOT mean for every investment in production of raw materials made then an equavalent should be made on the finnished product end.
    It would be unreasonable to ask a mining company trying to invest in Zambia to tie their invastment to production of cars at the same time. Their expertise will most likely be in Minning.
    So the only feasible way is to get the miner, then subsequently the car manufacturer.
    Ba super debater, I cant explain it any simpler.

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  37. 40# No you are wrong Chinese investment in Zambia is not a complete one because we still have to buy same products from china or europe made from our raw materials we are paying 4 times as much in Terms of transport, taxes, if china wants should also build a processing industry in Zambia for the Zambian market. All the copper, cobalt, Zinc etc they go one govt owned company in east china. This firm produces goods for the chinese and import. Do you get the point.

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  38. Easy 41, it would be good if the chinese doubled as producers of raw materials as well as processors at the same time. However, there are many things copper can be processed into, i am sure you dont want to entrust all that to the chinese.Infact it might not be an attractive precondition to ask all Miners to come up with what they will process the copper into once allowed to mine. Our copper would remain in the ground and and we would still be wallowing in poverty on the surface!
    Firt things first! Mine the copper first, more investors will then be attracted by the availablle raw materials to process it from the source……But dont force the miner to do it for you. cant the processor be a zambian company really?

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  39. Hey 42 Can you name any Zambia who has so much money to open such an industry. Not even those who have stolen. They are risks involved when establishing a company unless a group of Zambians join hands as shareholders. By the way is the market there. How many housed are electricified or use solar. We have a lot to do for us to change things.Th reason why I said a complete chinese solution coul have been viable its because of the complaint made that the chinese are just there to make their pockect fat.

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  40. Angola has OIL boss!
    Luckily oil doesnt have to be processed, countries prefer importing it crude.
    Are you suggesting it is because they are processing some kind of raw materials?

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  41. Easy 43, are you saying if there are few Zambians who can afford to form companies to process the copper, then the onus is on the chinese?

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  42. 46# Hey you are missing the whole conception. Why are we complaining over chinese investment? Is not the poor payment and that they are taking away our raw material without Zambians benefiting. If you can back to my statement I said without a processing industry the chinese investment is not complete because Zambia is paying 4 times as much when they need the same products from this minerals. We have to import the products from somewhere. This is the same reason why the wesr doesnt want china to be in Zambia because they are losing out in terms of industries they have dominated for 100 yrs of years.

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  43. Conception? I will have to go off family planning then.

    “Chinese investments are ‘incomplete’ because they only end in raw materials” thats what i gather from your posting.

    If i am right, my answer is the onus is on us, ZAMBIANS to get them to invest in processing too. Well, it doesnt have to be chinese, so all we need is continue marketing ourselves.The 2 DO NOT have to be tied, mining is one aspect making cables like ZAMEFA does is step 2. We cant then ask ZAMEFA to mine their own copper,its upto them, they can simply buy from the chinese if they want.

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  44. 48# If ZAMEFA was a company capable of satifying the demostic market have they not since independence done that so you dont go off your family planing. Pilz read on this “China’s hunger for African minerals” Maybe you will understand what I mean. If need translation I will help you no problem

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  45. #40 I can tell for sure that you are not a business major if at all you have been to a university. What I am trying to say is that we need to have the manufacturing industry revamped regardless of who invest in it; Zambia should never allow a situation where we are importing finished product at a higher cost;when these products have been made with our raw materials. I suggest that you read about opportunity cost,scarce resources. We will never develop as a country with out the manufacturing industry and advanced technology.

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  46. 49, No need for translation its straight forward, i wont give any more examples to avoid further clouding of the argument .
    Tom #50, I hope you are NOT looking to China alone for manufacturing industry development? Good luck in your business major, Do NOT hesitate to defer you assessments/exams if they are nearing.

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  47. #50 You are absolutely right,I can only prefer to have Chinese investment in infra structure not as a partner in economic management.These investments wont mean anything for us, they will be taking our raw materials and dumping us with sub standard finished products,its not a 50:50 type of deal, the advantages will favour more the chinese than the Zambians and this is where the worry comes.Coupled with our weak regulation, things will just be a total mess.We need to develop our manufacturing base to supplement our non traditional exports without delay.

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  48. #52 That is the proper way of reasoning I like your point of view and they are well educated.

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