Zambia’s Dambisa Moyo, author of the new book Dead Aid, was on 1st June 2009 invited to take part in a debate at the Royal Ontario Museum in Canada. The question of the debate was “Is foreign aid to the developing countries doing more harm than good?”
Below is the summary of the debaters
Dambisa Moyo
“Dambisa Moyo makes a compelling case for a new approach in Africa” – Kofi Annan
Stephen Lewis
“There are few witnesses to Africa’s plight as powerful or eloquent as Lewis” – Time Magazine
Paul Collier
“His ideas should be at the centre of the policy debate” – The World Bank
Hernando De Soto
“The world’s greatest living economist” – Bill Clinton
Many thanks to one of our readers using the user id Chanda for posting the link on the site.
True the aid to Africa is dead especially with some of the conditions that are attached to it. The other thing is that some of the aid in terms of equipment is for those they have phased out or are obsolete. The solution in Africa is within the Africans and not the west. Any home that depends on aid from others will always be run by others and worst still will not be united. That is very true of our land. Zambia at some points had budgets with over 80% of funds from outside. That cripples your planning and operations are you can not do much until the funds are sent it. When do yuo know those funds will come in. Even when funds come in you have scams of unbelievable multitude by people like the accused Kapoko. How about devising schemes to not only improve our economies suatainably.
These white imperialists sure do love to tell us what to do and whats good for us. The same attitude is mirrored with the ‘toff’s’ at the economist magazine. Sometimes I think most imperialist economists cannot think outside the pragmatist drivel they have been taught to rehearse .I wonder if any of imperialists are willing to show us where the supposed Aid went via accounts and transparency instead of the photo op african starving child to emotionally blackmail people out of money.
Sorry I meant magnitude and not multitude lol.
Why doesnt this emminent zambian come and help build the nation? We have enough resources that cant seem to go round. She’s put the country on the world map, but could come and help like the rwandies wanted her.
She did good.# and is good for her in search of new job and marriage. And need more Zambian to be exposed like that. The topic of discussion was not important, its the same NGO bla bla bla bla.
#4 The first priority for people in diaspora is to provide civic education to Zambians and after we have a sensitized all Zambians then it is easy to start implementing policies towards those changes because then it becomes easier as the whole nation is on your side and Govt’s interference will be minimized or be at zero. I think the path Dambisa is on is the right one because if she can first convince donors then you know how easy it will be for African Govts to follow what the Donors say, and of course there will also be pressure from the general African population. Dambisa is doing her part , what influence are you making, it’s not enough just to be calling people back home when you know that there is a lot of resistance by our Government to change.
How many Diasporans have tried to go back home and implement what they have learnt in other countries but have faced so much resistance that they ended up being frustrated. First civic education is needed then it will easier to introduce what Diasporans have learnt from other countries. God bless Zambia.
#7 and #6 rightfully so. If Dambisa had written and published her book in Zambia it would have been gathering dust on bookshelves of UNZA bookstore. The only reason they are paying attention to her now is because they have seen the whole world paying attention to her. The idea of geographical presence in Zambia to help zambia is just a facade for the lets all go home brigade .
I for one do not see AID as a problem the problem is accountability and AID dependant and putting the funds in projects that are not meaningfull. Though we do accept that these institutions that donate are like a larger business out there to make profit. Maybe there should be some common ground and say they pay back some of what they have taken from Africa. Our leaders are our problem and our mentality towards the west.
There is nothing wrong with aid but the manner in which it is accepted and applied or not is the biggest problem
Dambisa argued her points well. I dont have my own opinions at this point.
Dear Bloggers,
Do not be cheated. Talking and Doing are two different things.
They say that it is easier SAID than DONE.
Research has shown that most people who are GOOD at making NOISE are very very BAD implementers.
This is a case at hand right now.
Think of what the likes of RB would do without DONOR AID in Zambia? Right now MOH is in total disarray.
Without having a bias towards our girl as the heading of the thread. I ,personally think both groups did a good job . Only wish our govt leaders will bother/ desire to listen to both arguments or the debate .
Bottom line is , the greatest need of Africa and Zambia in particular is good and visionary leadership.
# 11 Donovanosis
Thank you for bring up the point regarding MOH… there are too many 2 faced bloggers here who where quick to point out How bad the Government is doing when Donors decided to withhold funds to the MOH. Anyways as out people in authority always say Zambias forget easly.
What we should be looking at is renagotiating the terms under which we get the AID. and put it to use effectively and make sure people found wnting are dealt with the credit is not for there own benefit if everyone in Zambia actually saw where this money is being used they would appriciate it more if nothing comes out of it well then it is dead AID
This was a debate and a debate has its intend perspective to stimulate minds. Among the valid points that I noted and a very known one , is that our leaders are not accountable to the masses but the donors.
This could explain the apathy in voter turn up. Voters do not see hope in leadership.
Alkebulan the other Original name of Africa went into a recession when we accepted to do business according to the Western Economic Philosophy of materialism. Let us turn Back to God and work hard to built on Agriculture, Science, Art and Culture as taught by Christ.
Ephesians
6
1 Children, obey your parents in the Lord: for this is right. Col. 3.20
2 Honor thy father and mother; which is the first commandment with promise;
3 that it may be well with thee, and thou mayest live long on the earth. Ex. 20.12 · Deut. 5.16
4 And, ye fathers, provoke not your children to wrath: Col. 3.21 but bring them up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord.
5 ¶ Servants, be obedient to them that are your masters according to the flesh, with fear and…
Ephesians
6
1 Children, obey your parents in the Lord: for this is right. Col. 3.20
2 Honor thy father and mother; which is the first commandment with promise;
3 that it may be well with thee, and thou mayest live long on the earth. Ex. 20.12 · Deut. 5.16
4 And, ye fathers, provoke not your children to wrath: Col. 3.21 but bring them up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord.
5 ¶ Servants, be obedient to them that are your masters according to the flesh, with fear and trembling, in singleness of your heart, as unto Christ;
6 not with eyeservice, as menpleasers; but as the servants of Christ, doing the will of God from the heart;
7 with good will doing service, as to the Lord, and not to men:
8 knowing that whatsoever good thing any man…
8 knowing that whatsoever good thing any man doeth, the same shall he receive of the Lord, whether he be bond or free. Col. 3.22-25
9 And, ye masters, do the same things unto them, forbearing threatening: knowing that your Master also is in heaven; Col. 4.1 neither is there respect of persons with him.
All these arguments are a huge time and money waster just like the conferences, seminars etc on HIV/AIDS have been. Work is what matters. Talking your way on a subject does not change a thing. People will of course acknowldege how articulate and knowledgeable some one might be but it ends just there. Action is what is required.
We need actions and good actions indeed , however , actions can stated as ideas of an actor put in motion . In this regard the most top actors are politicians . Without good ideas their actions will result in bad and misdirected ones.
Well,i prefer not to talk about the subject above because if i start thinking about how foreign aid is manipulated it makes my blood boil.But in any case i will pose this question: what would you prefer,being a well fed slave or being a hungry free man? Hope you all know what i mean profoundly.
China moved 300 hundred million out of poverty. Wow! that is the whole of the southern region of Africa and then some.
WHat type of devil is the IMF I need anaswer to this pressing question. And which clowns actually run and own it?
#20 I prefer to be a free hungry man because I can do something about it. As for the well fed slave he will always be a slave which unfortunately fits us regarded as poor nations. No wonder ther is no change for the good but the worst. Even this undocumented thinking that has been passed on from generation to generation that a white man is better than black man has really worsened our economic position. They can come in anytime buy our resources at laughable prices, rip us off and take off at will but still we go back to them to asking them to come and invest more and also for aid. All we are saying you have not taken enough please come back. When do we learn?
Paul Collier said Big countries have easier managable populations. OKay let me give an example how easy is it to govern a family of twelve, 10 children two parents, Ba Collier boza. Dawinian theories try to put us down as primitive, even when we Intiated civilization. Hernando Desoto spoke sense when he Gave an example of Canada that has a minute population as compared to the U.S and England. Wow! China and India do not have resources like the Big A. 1984 this is your line of expertise please advise.
Others want our land,
others want to adopt our children,
others want our mineral resources,
others give us money to hold us at ransom
in the end they want it all
and we give it willingly and blindly, one thing at a time
The slave ships may have long gone from our harbors
but the yokes are still around our necks
and the shackles on our ankles
We have to liberate ourselves
Dambisa spends a lot of time in Zambia and other African countries. If we want true independence then we should stop being dependent. Aid is there for the interest of those giving it. How many dictators have been propped up by aid? We need to devise new ways of creating wealth. How can we trust our development to the same people that enslaved us and colonised us? Since when did they have our best interests at heart? One way in which we can strengthen ourselves is to speak with one voice, that is why we need a United States of Africa.
Mbala boy I shall have to stop you there, we do not need a one Africa; that a recipe for the one world order. Like Ants we can be independent and yet work together. Forget the Unification of our Continent, for it shall carry more bloodshed than good, ask 1984 he tell that dark story well. Yes we can over come our post colonial masters due to the lack of a better term buy denying material poisoning.
United States of Africa is the devils scheme always keep that in mind.
Mwanawakwetu, you were really bored, spending sunday ukusabaila. I think you even managed to watch all those videos. Is good for Dambisa’s CV. But personally I rather watch Animal Planet, on serving whales than discussing poverty.
We humbly need that Aid ,no doubt about it.If we can have true leadership like the late LPM had ,all these debates will be history.
IS DAMBISA MOYO A ZAMBIAN OR A ZIMBABWEAN. WE NEED TO FIND OUT HER ORIGIN BEFORE WE CLAIM HER TO BE OURS. IT IS VERY RARE FOR A ZAMBIAN TO THINK LIKE HER
#31 Ba inzi, And it is very rare for Zambians to act maniacally like Mugabe. What an ***** that you are!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
#31 Ba Inzi, she is very much Zambian
#31 Ba inzi, It is also very rare for zambian to think and act like Mugabe. How shallow can you get, my brother?!!!
To #29, Philanthropist: Please, no one is holding a gun to your head for you to pay audience to this subject/topic. If issues of poverty doesn’t interest you; well, another episode of “Starving Gorillas in the Congo” is waiting for you on “Animal Planet.” Just don’t put down people who want to discuss and exchange ideas about important issues such as this (poverty). Move on my friend, and no one will notice!!!!!
There is nothing new in this debate,its quite shallow anyways,No man’s knowledge here can go beyond his experience.Once you’ve accumulated sufficient knowledge to get by, you’re too old to remember it.
#31 Dambisa Moyo whether zambian or zimbabwean is not a great deal ,she only has information but remember that Information is not knowledge.The small part of ignorance that we arrange and classify we give the name of knowledge.
Wow!
#36. Please learn to give credit where it’s due!
She has not invented anything but the lady has done a great job in raising the point!
Do you feel bad because she has written a book about “nothing new” and got credit for it before you did it? You can still write another book, continue where she left off or just start afresh and debate about it and get credit for it! With the information and knowledge you have about the matter, am sure yours is going to be a show stopper!
Dambisa Moyo (PhD, UK) had a good presentation. Let those with ears hear. I hope GRZ will use her for expert advice though it could be at a huge cost now that she is a world popular figure.
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Prevention is better than cure.
31 Ba inzigreetings and on your “IS DAMBISA MOYO A ZAMBIAN OR A ZIMBABWEAN. WE NEED TO FIND OUT HER ORIGIN BEFORE WE CLAIM HER TO BE OURS. IT IS VERY RARE FOR A ZAMBIAN TO THINK LIKE HER , she is very Zambian and we are not claiming here but she claims so herself. However, I think I read that her father was from South Africa in an except from her “Dead Aid” book.
Keep well.
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Prevention is better than cure.
Where in her book does she say her father was from South Africa? I have read her entire book (Dead Aid) and never saw that part—-did I miss something? What she says in her book, and in subsequent interviews I have seen of her, is that both her parents were from rural Zambia and met at the University of Zambia when they were both students there.
From the comments so far made I see that not many of you have taken the time to carefully listen to the core arguments Ms.Moyo is making in her book and with Mr.Soto in those videos posted.For most of the bloggers as the bembas say “mule senda ichushi pa mulilo” ( taking the smoke out of the fire) instead of taking the fire. The woman’s ideas are not new but they are ideas whose time is soon comming for zambia. The 18 year MMD reform movement from which MMD party and its offshoots like PF,UPND and other mutations political parties drive their policy thinking from is comming to a close. The ideas in Ms.Moyo’s book have caught the zambian ruling party MMD, opposition parties, and zambian aid industry driven NGOs & civil society unaware. They are precursors to a third way.
40 Yambayanda greetings and thanks for nice data on “Where in her book does she say her father was from South Africa? I have read her entire book (Dead Aid) and never saw that part—-did I miss something?” check out “They came from different tribes, from different parts of rural colonial Africa: my father, the son of a miner in apartheid South Africa; my mother, the daughter of a man who would later train to be a teacher” under the title Excerpt From ‘Dead Aid’
from zambian w a t c h d o g through a google search. I had put up the link but LT seems to have removed it probably to protect their business from competitors.
Take care boss.
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Prevention i
#42, What does that information have to do with the merits or de-merits of the ideas Ms.Moyo is advocating? The tactic of avoiding discussing the ideas advocated by the posted videos and a descent into discussing smoke screens is evidence that demonstrates that people bankrupt of ideas are avoiding being painted in a corner of ignorance. It is better to remain silent if you do not understand the ideas and implications of them than display folly by raising smoke screens. Leave the raising of smoke screens for MMD’s Tentamashimba or Hon.Mulongoti. If you remain silent and think more criticallly you would ask how did Ms.Moyo’s ideas get so much prominence among donors and why did Father Bwalya come from nowhere among zambia’s poor urban masses to the point of censure by the catholic…
43 Zambian greetings. On your “#42, What does that information have to do with the merits or de-merits of the ideas Ms.Moyo is advocating? ….” Are you sure you are referring to me?
In case you have a challenge in the English Language, check out 40 and 31 above. You should learn to read properly before you make useless comments that show the whole world that you are ignorance.
Have a nice day.
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Prevention is better than cure.
number 31..Dambisa is a highly claimed economist and should given credit for what she has done..bear in mind that they are some of us as women who are trying to make it in life by doing what is good for our country..l market my country to the best of my potential and yes they are intelligent women in my lovely Zambia..RESPECT TO DAMBISA YOU HAVE DONE ME AND MY COUNTRY PROUD
Dambisa Moyo is great!
Bear in mind that Moyo and de Soto are products of Western economics training, which indoctrinates its pupils with free market fundamentalism.
These fundamentalists tend to start with free market solutions and rationalize everything toward that goal. Rationalizations seem more convincing in the field of economics, where the lack of empirical evidence is glaring.
There are three billion people living on under $2 per day. One trillion dollars over 60 years is peanuts compared to the economies of even the poorest nations. It works out to providing 23 million people with $2 per day over that time span.
Sure, aid is flawed. But the biggest problem with aid is that we’re not providing enough of it. To suggest it’s a net negative for the continent is absurd. Laissez-faire, property rights and other Ayn Rand fantasies are not the answer.
Sorry to say but actions speak louder than words…..Why can’t she help advise our govt on economic issues that help the country this is her opportunity if she really want to replace donor aid
I am amazed by how much this lady is drawing attention with such absurd ideas. In her mind, eliminating aid will solve Africa’s problems. I am afraid the problem is not white and black as she sees it. Most of our problems are due to poor leadership, greed and corruption. That is an area where we need to focus and it will not come right overnight.
We need a lot of people starting their own businesses and employing themselves. Surely aid could help us attain such goals if the right people manage the funds. I am sure our western partners and donors are a bit disappointed with this debate after all the efforts they have made to alleviate poverty.
This lady is simply a TALK SHOP with no concrete solutions to how problems can be solve straight from lecture rooms of western universities.
She’s one of the greatest contemporary development economists. I salute her!
Dr. Moyo is right and we need to strongly support her because western scholars in their traditional hypocrisy are probably jealous of her brilliance and want to snob her ideas. I salute you my dear sister!