The Barotse Royal Establishment (BRE) says it is now ready for negotiations with Government of the Republic of Zambia on the controversial Barotseland Agreement of 1964.
Speaking at a press briefing at the Kuta in Limulunga district today, BRE Prime Minister , also known as Ngambela locally, Nyambe Mwenda said the BRE has concluded its pre-dialogue consultation process in respect to the pending negotiations.
The BRE had concertized the formation of a dialogue Council which will handle the negotiations with government, the Ngambela said.
He told the media that the council would comprise representatives of communities, Barotse political activists, the institutions of traditional governance structures and specific nominees of the BRE.
The Ngambela disclosed that the dialogue Council will be unveiled after a meeting of the district Chiefs and their Kutas in due course.
Mr Mwenda expressed his gratitude to President Edgar Lungu’s commitment to engage in direct negotiation with the Barotse Royal Establishment and for providing a conducive environment for the BRE to work through the process of pre-dialogue consultation.
The Ngambela also extended appreciation of the Litunga Lubosi Imwiko II to the people of Barotseland for their patience during the period leading to the current position.
Interesting. I would be interested to see the map of barotseland.
I don’t understand anything about Barotseland and quiet frankly I don’t want to be enlightened.
Cant stand the Lozis or Tongas and I wouldn’t touch one even when coerced . They think they are all that, well guess what, YOU ARE NOT !
I am a Phd holder
Thanks
BB2014,2016
Pa Mafi Mushota thinks she’s all that ,mscheeew a Phd holder in hubris ,snobbishness and contempt.
Desperate Lungu thinks by opening “dialogue” He will win over Western Province. This is desperation at its best. I guess Mama Inonge is getting the last laugh. She will the a heroine in her home town. Lunch will … well he has no known hometown.
So basically the british colonialists came and distributed land to the original inhabitants. How stup!d this sounds. Today we see wars in Nigeria biafra people wanting their land which was given to them by british colonists. Now this same nonsense is about to happen in Zambia. Glow up bangwele. I am full time Kaonde and North western is our land and non is for Lozis. There are many tribes in Western province who also have an equal share to the land. Lozi is just a tribe no better than the rest of the Zambian 75 tribes. you fight for land while the chinese get land for free.
A people without culture or history prone to identity crisis. Lets support the malozi folks.
I mean as a people we are prone to lose of identity if we discard our culture. Instead we are strong with cultural values.
My interest is how the lunda, luvale and the kaonde would take to being forced to speak lozi and knee before the litunga
BAD IDEA
SEND THE AGREEMENT TO THE ARCHIVES
NO PATRIOTIC ZAMBIAN WANTS THIS AGREEMENT TO BE REVIVED
IT WILL CAUSE UNTOLD HARM
IF IT IS IMPLEMENTED THEN ALL LOZIS SHOULD BE REPATRIATED TO WESTERN PROVINCE
THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS BAROTSELAND NOW
JULIET PERTH: Cool it. In the areas the Litunga ruled, he used to appoint chiefs. I’m not aware of any Kaonde chiefs being appointed by the Litunga. There is a map of Barotseland and it does not include N-W Province. I do not think myself that most reasonable people from Barotseland want to break away from Zambia. They are agitating for restoration of powers and privileges that the Litunga has traditionally excercized over his territory which KK’s govt diluted without discussion.
We are stupid. KK the guy who signed the docs mulemutambafye alefwa. Gets facts from the guy before lights out.
What the hell is there to discuss? Zambia is a unitary state. We need just credible leaders to develop Zambia period!
shut up! Go and get a job
Thanks
BB2014, 2016
Zambia is unitary state but not a fair one. We need proper dialogue on what it is we want to be and these negotiations will just be a start of something bigger. You can’t say you are building one Zambia one nation when some people’s identities are not respected even in lands where their ancestors are buried. Not even in names of places, residential areas, roads etc. For those really curious about map of Barotseland, get a copy of the Barotseland Agreement of 1964 and a book titled KINGDOMS OF THE SAVANNAH whose author I forget.
How can you develop when you have so many saboteurs crying over lost presidency?
@citizen, I agree with you. If you are going to discuss, discuss the development plans for Western Province. Upfront, tell the BRE, the non-negotiables – the country is not up for partitioning and with that understanding, let us hear your issues etc. End of the story, do not give any impression that the partitioning of the country is on the agenda.
What are you talking about? Grow up !
Thanks
BB2014,2016
This will be the only chance for HH to rule once he’s given the protectorate.
Another backward agenda by people with evil intentions to divide the country.
There is no division of the country envisaged here. Arrogance in interactions with fellow citizens can’t tolerated forever. Listen to your ZNBC local language broadcasts. Are those people told who else they represent? Does everyone’s culture count in terms of songs? Open tribal talk has not been punished and you want one Zambia one nation? Perish the thought!
One Zambia One Nation One President.
Zambia should be curved up into new tribal federations to blunt the offensive Bemba hegemony.Go Barotse go for it be free from the current disrespect of your great Kingdom that predates Zambia.
Bemba hegemony wakuti? You have a Nsenga president and a Lozi vice president. Some studies show that since independence, Lozis have have actually been over represented as regards high government positions in relation to their numbers in the overall Zambian population. Will the discussions also include representatives of other ethnic groups currently residing in Western province such as the Mbundas, Subiyas and Nkoyas to name a few?
Useless dog who is sweeping white man toilets
Post is for number 6 above
There will be no dividing up of the country. America has so much diversity but it functions. It boils down to accepting and living with diversity which is natural thing really. Someone described fellow citizens as FITEKWA right here on LT. How much condemnation has that attracted? The school syllabus will have to be altered so that proper nation-building is included, what commonalities we have etc.
Maybe it is good that this issue has reached this stage, quite early before we get into “real election fever” in 2 year’s time! Like @1 Max has said it would be very interesting to see where the map of Barosteland extends and also like what @ 2 Citizen and @3 Chali have said, it would be good to agree that we are weld together by a history of now 54 years and have been moving together! If it is developmental issues, they also have to understand how under developed some provinces are compared to Western Province, taking into consideration recent developments that have taken place putting the province well ahead of some other rural provinces!
This should not be intertained at all, nothing to discuss BRE is non existible in this developed world, na ka mushota nakapelako insambu
I thought that this matter is dead. Okay if not. Make Mongu a city and the BRE can choose a Mayor. Remember mayors are elected so that is big big concession. What do you think Baroness Patricia Scotland?
The Barotseland agreement was declared null and void by the British govt at Independence because the agreement was never between the British Govt and The Royal Establishment but the BRE and the British South Africa Company. Both parties cheated each other- the Nkoyas (Lozis) cheated the whites that they owned all the land up to the Beglian Congo and the whites cheated the Nkoyas that they represented the British Empire which was not entirely true. The Nkoyas (Lozis) lied that the Lambas, Kaondes, Luvales, Lundas, Ilas, Tongas were their slaves and as such these tribes had no say as all their land was sold to the British South Africa company. They sold land which was not theirs. Those who dispute this please read on the History of Northern Rhodesia and how it came to be. It is all about…
Comments I am seeing here are the very reason that this dialogue ought to take place.
Ctn…Its all about mineral rights. Mineral rights especially in the Copperbelt, as a Lamba, Luvale or Kaonde would you agree that your village and your ancestral land belongs to the BRE? There is no written or oral history that says Nkoyas (Lozis) ruled Copperbelt or NW province. The only history which is there is that they subjugated certain tribes in Southern province.
why should such talks be announced just before the dreaded KUOMBOKA CEREMONY? IS IT YOUR PRESIDENT HH telling u to do so ? Bad timing , can’t wait to see LOZIS and TONGAS OUT OF MY BEAUTIFULL ZAMBIA, LET THEM BE ON THEIR OWN, I HEAR THEY HAVE OWN NATIONAL ATHEM, FLAG AND MOTTO. PLEASE GIVE THEM THEIR SAND
Who dreads the Kuomboka ceremony? And how does HH come into it? There is nation-breaking hatred in Zambia and the school syllabus is perhaps the place to start addressing it. I consider hatred a waste of energy. Better to address issues.
Ctn…Point to take Note- Nkoya’s are the first tribe to inhabit Western Province then came these other tribes such as the Lozis (Luyuna). It is a common habit to call Lozis Nkoya and vice versa but truth of the matter is Nkoya’s themselves were even excluded from this so called Barotse Agreement. The other tribes such as the Mbundu, Kwangwa, Luvale were also excluded by the Lozis Luyuna who were only concerned with the welfare of their royal clan – descendants of Sibetwane – the real Lozis who are just a tiny number not more than 10,000 individuals. So in other words many calling themselves Lozis are not even Lozi but Nkoyas (from Luba-Lunda) who were cheated by the descendants of Sibetwane the Luyuna (foreigners).
We should not mix nkoyas and lozis
The land the lozis want to occupy is actually nkoya land.
Lewanika is not a lozi name nkoya.
The lozis found the nkoyas were not
They killed them like chickens and assimilated them.ensuring that they killed their sense of identity.
No real normal nkoya loves
The lozis must go to basutholand and claim their land
Give them the sad to make BaLozi Chibuku glass and selfish to Namibia and Zambia. How can a white thief issue of old be an issue today? Stolen property be shared?
2020vision: Cool it please. Muna Ndulo’s PhD thesis later published as a book MINING RIGHTS IN ZAMBIA lays it bare. If you don’t know , don’t spread your ignorance. You are free to speculate though so long you make it clear.
Please look up this book those of you in universities in English-speaking countries: KINGDOMS OF THE SAVANNAH by Jan Vansina published by University of Wisconsin Press. The map of Barotseland is there.
The map of Barotseland then, but not any more!
@chanchima True or False did the Nkoya’s come from Luba-Lunda before the Lozis? And were the Lozis called Luyuna and does Luyuna mean Foreigner? Answer to both is true.
Are Lozis not descendants of Sibetwane’s Makololo that emigrated from Lesotho only in the 19th century whereas the Nkoya migrated from DRC in the 12th century? Answer True.
Lastly these same mineral rights were they not initially signed by BSAC and not the British Empire? True.
There is no written record or oral history to confirm lands extending into Lambaland and Kaondeland etc were ever ruled by Lozis or Nkoya people. Chiefs of those tribes have never be subordinates to the Luyuna (foreigner) Lewanika. True.
So @chancima you dull educated fool of a cretin you can go back to the shell of ignorance you came from!
@chancima what I’ve said is the truth and is supported by facts.
Take time to read “Tears of Rain” by Malama Katulwende a factual historical account of how what is known as Barotseland was first occupied by the Nkoya people from Luba-Lunda as early as the 12th Century but then invaded by a small tribe from Lesotho as recently as the 19th century and how that tribe assimilated and became known as Lozi (Luyuna-meaning foreigner).
Correction the Book Tears of Rain was written by Wim Van Binsbergen. Malama Katulwende introduces the book.
Your history of Barotse is extremely flawed. The Luyanas’ (Alui) ruling class of the Barotse originated from Western Congo Luba-Lunda Kingdom. Some of the indeginous tribes they found there were Kwangas. Luvales and Nkoyas’ also came from Congo and some from Angola. The name Lewanika was given to Lubosi the King of Barotse by the same Luvale and Nkoyas’ ( Luyana ku wanika) meaning the uniter he gave them protection. The Makololos’ you are talking about came 200 years + after the Kaluyi had settled in Barotse. The Luyi ruling class married across tribes in Barotse and Southern province, some of the Paramount Chiefs have Nkoya blood. It is also the reason the Luis’ and Lundas’ address each other as (Kaluyi Mwamba – Kalunda Mwamba) They came from same Kingdom led by members of same…
The Makololos’ invaded Barotse during the time when there was leadership succession wrangle between Silumelume and Mubukwanu, sons of the great Luyana King Mulambwa who had died. You will note that Luis’ managed to reorganise themselves and eventually hit back and killed almost all the Makololo men, few who survived fled into Namibia. The Makolo women were shared amongs the Alui ruling class, its during that period that the Lozi lingua came into being. Lozi is but a language, bit like Tseswana or Sesotho. Makololos’ were one of the three clans running away from Shaka, one clan settled in Lesotho, second in Botswana third is one crossed the Zambezi to Barotse and got wiped out 25yrs later by Alui.
Let’s have a referendum in the so called Barotseland. Let the Tongas -lozis -Mbundas -Nkoyas -Mbukushus -Subiyas -Lambas -Kaondes -Luvales -Lundas and the other ethnic groups in the so called Barotseland vote whether they want to be under the Litunga or not. If the if the outcome of the referendum will be “yes” then let the people’s will be done. The BRE should not hold each government which comes in at ransom in perpetuity.
Give them autonomy; and give autonomy to other provinces; Federal government type system is what Zambia needs; thanks; I have a PhD like Mushota;
Sounds good.
@19 Jabule. In the final analysis, I am with you on that suggestion. @ 2020vision and @chancima, thanks to you both for enlightenment. But as you might both be aware, historical narratives are not neutral. That you are quoting two sources which make different claims is proof of my point.
This is fake news meant to cause confusion at the expense of development. False stories will cause the end of the world.
@Mpundu, Chancima is quoting a source which discusses the precolonial history of the region as a whole so it is not a specific source of information on the subject matter. Putting an old map in a book doesn’t mean anything, those maps where both historically and geographically incorrect. The book he quotes is not accurate and discusses several kingdoms thus diminishing its relevance to the subject. The book I quote is specific on the Nkoya people and how they were robbed by Sibetwane’s descendants (the Luyuna (Lozi) foreigners).
@2020 vision. Thanks for your explanation. I have just finished reading Malama’s article ‘Tears of Rain……’dated March 09, 2012 posted on ukzambians.co.uk. I hope to read more on the topic.
Aala, so imwe bakolwe bonse muli bena Congo? Then why do you laugh at us ba tubulu! kupuusa ngaako.
If you listen to some of the original Luyana words you will be amazed at similarities with Bemba, in Luyana for instance, fine is wino or to emphsasise very fine (wino wino). There is an even more common origin of the Luyanas’ with the Bembas than there is with the Kololos. The articles Malama wrote were influenced by late Mr Nkomeshya a Nkoya from Kaoma who was serving someone’s interest to rewrite the Lozi history so as to weaken the calls for autonomy which had become heated by 2012. If the Luis’ were a mere 10,000 people, how were there able to invade such a great tribe as the Tongas? To the contrary at the height of their impis constituted 30,000 men as documented by Francois Coillard who established missions in Barotse and lived in Lealui.
The timing of the discussion is suspicious. Is someone talking to Patricia to fix Zambia after being dared.
Very funny indeed. No wonder less development in that part of Zambia because most of the people in that part of Zambia are occupied with the Barotse Agreement something that was created by a white man instead of concentrating on developmental issues to improve the welfare of the people!
We should be more concerned with the origin of some of our national leaders and those before them, than question the origin of an indigenous tribe which has existed in that part of the region for over 500 years with well documented evidence.
YOU WERE MANIPULATED AND USED BY THE WHITES WHO LEFT YOU WITH NOTHING BUT THE LITUNGA SUIT…LOOK AT HOW HE LOOKS …A BLACK CHIEF IN THE WHITE MAN’S CLOTH.. AREAS LIKE SIOMA NATIONAL PARK, LUAMPA, CHIENGA WERE PART OF LIVINGSTONE. BUT WITH THE BACKING OF THE WHITES WHO HAD GUNS..YOU SHAMELESSLY STOLE OUR LAND. ..ITS WATER UNDER THE BRIDGE , WE HAVE MOVED ON ..WE ARE ONE ZAMBIA ONE NATION.
The conflicting stories about who was who in Barotseland reminds me of the saying that “if the lion can not write it’s own history then the hunter will do it for it. “
E.B HIBALWA – why are you on the internet invented and delivered to you by the white-man? Wabe chintu chobe! Uli lifi.
Can we clearly have the Barotseland guys explain to the rest of the Zambians what it is exactly they want? This can be done by inviting them to a live Television and Radio hard talk show where they can inform the rest of Zambia what it is they want. Is it a complete separation from the rest of Zambia and become a country or Kingdom on their own or what? It is better to get facts from the Litunga himself. Zambia cannot be discussing this issue without resolving it. Resolve this issue once and for all, for some of us are tired of being reminded all times of the same crap. What is the problem kanshi???
LUKANGA KAFUSHA JUSTICE: Northern Rhodesia and Barotseland were run as seperate protectorates by the British, the same way North-Eastern Rhodesia and North-Western Rhodesia were until 1911 if you remember your history. Strictly-speaking, NR was a colony while Barotseland was a protectorate because in Barotseland the British interfered less in many traditional matters than in NR. But on proceeding to independence the British decided to merge NR and Barotseland but on condition that the Litunga would retain certain powers and privileges over Barotseland even in an independent Zambia. Kaunda’s govt abrogated this condition without consulting the Litunga in late 1960s.
And the capital of peoples republic of BAROTSELAND would be what? tourism aka Kuomboka the economic pillar? You make me fart laughing! Really! Oh theres fishing too!
Everything under the sun is meaningless according to the bible. So let us be wise by asking wisdom from God(Jehovah). Finger pointing and nick naming other tribes is a sign of immaturity and madness. At some point if you notice your brother (tribe(s) is acting strange, call him and reason together in a civilised manner.You lose nothing! Olo mitengo kapena matako amakweshana whatmore human beings?!You reap what you put in the soil.So let us be proactive rather than being reactive in the way we talk or approach issues in life as a nation. Avoid abusing internet platforms like this one it is our private home property. Learn to learn and be respectful and be willing to listen from others you will win even the hearts of your enemies. But if you demonstrate narrow mindset,you will not archive…