Zambia Police Summon Opposition leaders for holding Indoor meeting without permit

1. These should be punished severely for unlawful assembly.

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   • Police are just following the current law which PF used for the past 10 years

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2. So the people fought for nothing. Shame.

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3. Zambia chabe. Awe mwe. Is the police afraid to be independent? Is the minister of home Affairs afraid of ‘enforcing’ the President’s directive of freedom of assembly (even though it’s a constitutional provision).
   I am highly disappointed.

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4. ZP please hold your horses. We don’t want this unnecessary intimidation of the opposition to continue in Zambia. If UPND holds a meeting or press conference, does it require a permit? The purpose of the police permit is to ensure that police can provide any security that might be required, especially in the case where opposing party members might clash. This is not the case anymore as PF which used to cause such chaos has been subdued. Go focus on real crime and threats to security than harassing peaceful, toothless opposition leaders.

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5. the more things change, the more they remain the same.

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6. What a failed country! I thought it was debunked long time ago in a court of law that political parties (or indeed anyone) don’t need a police permit to hold a political assembly, let alone a press conference. That if protection was required, the police are informed for them to turn up and provide security or de-conflict their schedule and determine resources availability.
   So what kind of n0nsense is this from these good for nothing c0ps. Is HH and UPND condoning this type of police n0nsense to victimize their oolitical opponents? What a huge let down by HH and his UPND.

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7. Who has bewitched Zambia kanshi? Could it be that the witch is already dead? People had so much hope in BMW and his New Dark regime but its turning to be an illusion, a tantalizing mirage.

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8. Where are the bottle necks to remove some of these retrogressive laws?? Dear Bally, just as you are in a hurry to eradicate corruption so should you be with public order act & anything that impedes on freedom of association & expression. We need all voices to be heard without hindrance even if they are from *****s like Sean tembo. It’s the freedoms we we desperately needed hence why we voted PF out

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9. Why are you complaining. The law the requires people to get permits is still on force. It has not been changed yet. The same people who are complaining did not change that law for 10 years and used it to intimidate others. We also want to enjoy it the way you enjoyed it before we can change it.

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10. The public order act needs urgent revision. While it is in force the police will always use that excuse to intimidate opposition parties. The act must be revised within this current seating of parliament as a matter of urgency.

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11. I suspect some of the bloggers VOTED for PF, how then do you come here and say WHAT YOU HAD FOUGHT FOR WAS IN VEIN, when you did NOT even fight for the change that brought in current government?
    The issue with our politicians and bloggers here is that you either intentionally OR out of ignorance forget that existing LAWS are still in effect, UNTIL REPEALED in Parliament, that is WHEN we can expect the changes. As LONG as those laws are NOT repealed, the law enforcement will continue to follow through, DONT BLAME either the Police or GRZ. If they were Not going do so, you will be the same people calling out why Police is NOT acting.
    CHASE YOUR MPs – PF, INDEPENDENT or UPND, to start repealing those laws.!!!

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12. @ Razor,
    Exactly my point too.
    The fight should be directed to Parley and NOT complaining on LT. There is nothing that HH can do, unless he is a dictator !!!
    But luckily we have a democracy, where laws are formulated in Parley AND NOT by individuals or Parties.

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13. @Chiza Its a nation of cowards. The Police are always scared of the ruling party. The judges too so if you find them in court they rule for State House all the time. We should ask for Malawian judges.

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14. @11 I suspect some of the bloggers VOTED for PF, how then do you come here and say WHAT YOU HAD FOUGHT FOR WAS IN VEIN, when you did NOT even fight for the change that brought in current government? DON’T BEAT ABOUT THE BUSH, IT’S ME YOU ARE REFERRING TO. IN A DEMOCRACY EVEN THOSE WHO VOTE FOR THE OTHER WILL STILL ENJOY THEIR RIGHTS AS CITIZENS…. THEY DON’T BECOME ENEMIES OF THAT COUNTRY. BY THE WAY BECAUSE I BECAME SKEPTICAL OF OUR POLITICIANS I STOPPED VOTING IN 2001.

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15. @general Kanene, get real mate. 1st of all, there’s no law that says citizens have to ask for permission from the police to assemble. Freedom of assembly and association is enshrined in the Constitution and so the police are just abusing their powers. The said law simply says notifying the police so they can provide security in mass gathering that has the potential to turn violent. When did a press conference qualify as a mass public gathering or protest? And a judge had already ruled on this long time ago.
    2nd there’s no police decision to do with politics in Zambia that has no blessing from the govt at minister or presidential level.
    How come then that govt can pay lip service and say the police should deal with political cadres who attacked the DAO? Why couldn’t they say the same…

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16. …Why couldn’t they say the same that police should let the opposition enjoy their constitutional rights and freedoms? Why is the govt quiet? HH and UPND used to complain about the very same treatment when they were in the opposition, so what is different now? It’s because they are not the victims anymore.
    Lastly yes the UPND govt and their MPs in parliament could easily move a motion to get rid of the POA and the DOP (Defamation of the President)… that is if they had political will to do so. Last time you and I talked about this WRT Nakachinda, your excuse was that fixing the economy was the priority and not repealing such archaic laws. Let’s be honest and principled to condemn wrong things regardless of whether we are the victims or the beneficiary. I bet the PF and the MMD…

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17. Does an indoor meeting require a permit. I am behind guys, educate me.

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18. …I bet the PF and the MMD numskulls wish they had gotten rid of such bad laws because now they are being used against them. Be the defender and champion of the truth… even if you support someone or a certain political party.

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19. #14 @Deja Vu, I agree with you 100%. Just because you voted for the party that didn’t win the elections doesn’t mean you can’t talk against bad governance of those in power. You have the same moral right as any other citizen to demand what is right for you and the country. However, don’t be hypocritical to condemn the same thing you praised not long ago (if you had supported the evils). See being objective regardless of who you support helps in preserving your integrity. PF were doing exactly the same things UPND are doing now, did you condemn them then? Bloggers should be objective and not act like uncivilized cadres.

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20. #19… that is the weakness of the human being…we don’t expect that tomorrow you will be on the other side. Just look at how people used to literally kneel before Edgar….. today he cuts a very lonely sad figure. Maybe since HH hasn’t entered State House he may be able to survive the spirit that makes people lose their original self.

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21. #19 Thanks. Only one benefitting from thuggery can support it. Unfortunately I came to know about Lusaka Times through a link sent by a friend very late otherwise you were going to know my stand on political parties. My belief is to appreciate the good Government is doing but not to praise them… they chose the job, they get paid so they should just work.

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22. #15, 16 & 18 – @Jigga Kayama Simangulungwa,
    Mate, I BEG to differ, there is no definition of what you have just quoted. Lets review what the POA says:
    1] “meeting” means a meeting held for the purpose of the discussion of matters of public interest or for the purpose of the expression of views on such matters;

    2] WHAT POA says on Regulation of assemblies, public meetings and processions
    Section 5
    (4) Every person who intends to assemble or convene a public meeting, procession or demonstration shall give police at least seven days notice of that person’s intention to assemble or convene such a meeting, procession or demonstration.

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23. #15, 16 & 18 – @Jigga Kayama Simangulungwa

    3] WHAT POA says about Unauthorized assemblies
    Section 7
    Any assembly, meeting or procession-
    (a) for which a permit is required under subsection (4) of section five and which takes place without the issue of such permit; or

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24. #15, 16 & 18 – @Jigga Kayama Simangulungwa,

    4] WHAT POA says Penalty for disobeying a direction or violating conditions of permit issued under section 5
    Any assembly, meeting or procession-
    (a) for which a permit is required under subsection (4) of section five and which takes place without the issue of such permit;
    shall be deemed to be an unauthorised assembly, and all persons taking part in such assembly, meeting or procession and, in the case of an assembly, meeting or procession for which no permit has been issued, all persons taking part in convening, calling or directing such assembly, meeting or procession may be arrested without a warrant and
    shall on conviction be liable to a fine not exceeding one thousand five hundred penalty units or to imprisonment for a period not…

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25. #15, 16 & 18 – @Jigga Kayama Simangulungwa
    Conclusion: Mate, I just want to make it clear, I am NOT in anyway in favour of POA or DOP, however, my point is
    1] There is valid and existing law, whether we like it or Not, and has to be adhered to UNTIL repealed. Please, do NOT fall prey to the gimmicks of the opposition. My position would NOT change even if UPND was in opposition.
    2] Pressure must be on Parley to move swiftly and enact repealment and new updated laws put in place. Whinning and complaining on LT by politicians is NOT solving issues.
    3] Motion to repeal archaic laws can ALSO be started by OPPOSITION MPs, what is PF doing?

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26. #14 – @Deja Vu
    “IN A DEMOCRACY EVEN THOSE WHO VOTE FOR THE OTHER WILL STILL ENJOY THEIR RIGHTS AS CITIZENS….”
    Indeed, Mate, so sit back and enjoy your rights as a citizen, but dont potray yourself as one who supported the change to happen, its simply NOT right. No one is taking your rights, but appreciate the freedom & rights that you are enjoying.
    You don’t have even an MP, otherwise, I would have recommended you talk to your MPs as what they are doing in Parley, why are they NOT fighting to repeal the POA and DOP, if that is critical to the citizens that voted for them.

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27. Its not about the pubic order act or whatever those who ‘ve passed through law school will agree that the constitution being the supreme law of the land,,, any statute that is enacted that is inconsistent with the constitution is null and void..therefore here under the bill of rights the constitution guarantees freedom of assembly why then should someone get permission to gather and share his thoughts on a particular subject… these are lacunas in the justice system that requires mending…honourable mp for lusaka central should adress this ASAP

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28. I am struggling with a lot of happenings in Zambia ine. So who triggers repeal of these laws? The Executive? What is parliament there for? To drink at the Assembly bar and sleep at the motel? Balekeni abo ma future leaders. This is getting embarrassing now. So you harass someone today tomorrow you salute them as head of state. Kwena eeee.

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29. I have been against the law from UNIP days but the problem with us Zambians is that we dont think strategically this law should have been got rid off years ago and there is no better time to get rid of now before this new govt gets comfortable with it. MMD were against it but when the got into govt it was a different issue, same with PF …its also vague.
    Anyway as I used to tell ministers in PF that if you tolerate this (colonial laws) you too will be next.

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30. I had a 10 minute meeting with my workers this morning. Apologies, I will go to the police station tomorrow and get a retrospective permit! What a load of hypocritical bullsh!t

31. @Sight
    @Kalok,
    Yes, alot of “lacunas in the justice system”, the question for me is WHAT is being done to get rid of those lacunas? The justice Minister has already indicated, that they are now working on the framework. As long that is in the pipeline, why let SEAN TEMBO & TEAM get the attention, since they are pretending they don’t know that POA still applies, and when they are called upon by Police, they take it as political persecution. RUBBISH !!!

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32. POLICE MUST UNDERSTAND PF IS DEAD DEAD
    MEETINGS ARE ALLOWED IF OPOSITION HAVE ISSUES LET THEM DICUSS THEM OPENLY

33. WE HAVE A NEW GOVERNMENT BUT AN OLD MIND SET

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34. @Tarino All what you have stated also applies to the Presidential defamation law. Even what another blogger says here that the constitution is supreme applies to the presidential defamation law. It is unconstitutional so it must be repealed. I think we should have a provision for automatically repealing laws that contradict our constitution because parliament will never do it for us. MPs are too comfortable to think about laws.. We also have a funny concept in Zambia that MPs should bring development to their constituency. What is government there for? MPs must focus on enacting laws!

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35. New Dawn Zambia Police as professional as ever, it is up to MPs to change the law. The Police are just enforcing the law the way it is, so nothing strange here, it is not even UPND to blame, The seven political parties have MPS who can take the motion to parliament, even the one man parties like for Fred Sean, Peter, Harry, Chishala, Andyford will benefit

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36. This is the more reason why the POA should be amended. The Police work on the demands of the law and in this instance they are not wrong as the law demands that you notify the Police before holding a public (political) gathering.

37. Why – if I might ask? Zambia is not a police state,..or, is it? Come on! At this rate, the police will certainly burnout in no time!

    #plant a tree now please!

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38. THEY NEEDED TO NOTIFY THE POLICE BUTH THEY DID NOT. THAT IS WHERE THE ISSUE IS.

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39. Sir, the essence of leadership lies in being able to give directions to the ‘led’ about your legal priorities. ECL did not allow the police to call out the ‘Alliance’ partners when they were holding meetings. Equally, he did not press on the police when they held public briefings. What has changed is political will, unjust laws are not always followed to the letter. It happens the world over

40. @general Kanene, thanks for quoting those sections. It starts with “notification” and suddenly jumps to “permit” and lack of. How did notification equal permission? Where was link between the two? A judge already clarified on this, look it up.
    In any case I don’t care what colonial law says… as I mentioned earlier and as #21 @sight say, it is unconstitutional because it denies citizens their rights to assemble and association. Besides the ‘meeting’ you have quoted is too wide and it effectively apply to churches; parliament; schools; universities; courts; etc. Do they all get permits, or how come they only target political meetings?

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41. @ Deja Vu, the people didn’t fight for nothing but they want to sit back instead of engaging the legislators that they elected to deal legislatively with the governance issues that have been of concern! It’s like the onus is being placed on the president who on his own can’t sponsor any bill unless the citizenry want the president to start issuing decrees then that would mean birth to authoritarian rule and death to democracy! But when one hears the citizenry beseeching the president’s intervention on many an issue one can’t help wondering why so much power rests in an individual!

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42. As for parliament, you know too well that the opposition have no chance of enacting any laws in Zambia. They simply have no numbers and at best they can only move a private member’s motion which process has lots of hurdles. Why are you putting the onus on the opposition, instead of the government who campaigned on the premise that they would repeal those POA and DOP laws? It pains me that seemingly intelligent people like you my friend are partial and lack objectivity. The HH govt will fall hard if they continue on their current trajectory. Let’s help them ‘see’ as they appear to be blinded and consumed with power already, forgetting they were in the opposition not long ago.
    Thanks for keeping the discussion civil by the way.

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43. This is gutless stupidity, just who thought such archaic draconian pieces of law would be enforced under HH? It’s disappointing.

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44. Right now Nevers Mumba is holding a joint meeting with Upnd without the so-called permit.

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