NO PERSON is born homosexual as some people believe, psychologist-cum-sex therapist Katele Kalumba and urologist Francis Manda have said, adding their voices to the raging debate on homosexuality.
Behavioural Scientist and sex therapist Katele Kalumba has said that homosexuality is a matter of choice because it is a learnt behaviour according to scientific research.
Dr Kalumba said some people are lured into it because of the money that is involved in the vice. He said some people get into the practice of homosexuality because of Western influence, which they tend to feel is the modern way to live.
Dr Kalumba said people adopt the lifestyle as a response to the socio-economic environment around them. Historically, Dr Kalumba said, only men went to mining areas where few women were available.
He said for example, Lamba women around the Copperbelt area in those days were too few to meet the sexual needs of men.
“In fact, men and women were not allowed to live together. As a result men were all forced to live together leading to homosexual practices,” he said. Dr Kalumba said because of men being isolated from women for long periods, they resorted to having sex among themselves, which was induced by the environment.
Zambia has lately been locked in a debate on homosexuality after United Nations secretary general Ban Ki-moon on his visit to Zambia called for respect for people’s sexual orientation.
And Dr Manda of the University Teaching Hospital (UTH) in Lusaka said homosexuality is developed when people are exposed to pornographic material while others do so through peer pressure.
He said homosexuality is usually induced by consensual sex between members of the same sex.
“When a man starts having sex with another man, and the two agree, he may eventually find himself being sexually-attracted to his fellow men instead of women. Once this happens then that person has become a homosexual,” Dr Manda said.
Dr Manda said homosexuality should not be confused with sodomy, which is when a man forcibly has sex with another male person without that person’s consent. “Sodomy is forced sex by one male on another, which is why it is a criminal offence in Zambia,” he said.
Dr Manda said homosexuality is more prevalent in urban areas where people are exposed to different cultures. “Even if Zambia has prohibited pornographic material, a number of people, especially in higher institutions of learning, have these materials, hence practising what they are seeing,” he said.
Dr Manda said in Zambia, some foreigners find it easy to lure young men into homosexual acts because of high poverty levels in the country. He said the boy-child is in danger of falling prey to homosexuality through enticement by some of the foreigners who have come to Zambia in the guise of community work.
Dr Manda said the absence of insaka for the boy-child in urban areas exposes him to the risk of experimenting different forms of sexuality because there is no guidance from elders, unlike the girl-child who is usually counselled by traditional counsellors and elders upon attaining puberty.
He said homosexual acts pose a high risk to HIV infection because of bruising caused by anal penetration. Dr Manda said the anus is very tight and may tend to bleed if subjected to too much pressure.
“Even in prison, HIV infection rates are very high due to sodomy. Way back prisons were our number one source of blood donors, but now we find that three quarters of blood samples are contaminated with HIV because of the practice,” he said.
He said if homosexuality is allowed, then the country can expect increased HIV infections. Dr Manda said gay people should enjoy their human rights and that it is wrong to isolate them and design laws specifically for them.
He said gay people need counselling because they suffer from mental disorder that comes from exposure to pornographic material or peer pressure.
[Zambia Daily Mail]
A black person cannot be an expert on homosexuality, let white people talk about it. If it is a western phenomenon why bother about it? Kalumba Katele has been on record for promoting masturbation when he was working at Chainama. All Africans should stick to what they know best, like spear throwing!!!
Racism is also not in-born; it is a choice.
Wempombo we! how dare and foolish you decide to expose your foolishness. This aspect of life is affecting everyone and not only the so call Westerners hence everyone can have a say about it according to the way they understand it. It has been brought into our in culture and need to discuss it!
ulichipuba iwe ayi….atase
Am I to understand that these two individuals are expressing their OPINIONS on the issue of gays? They have not provided any citations or references to reports on their views. Also these two people seem to be politically biased as on of them has held cabinet positions before. Please do not use this issue of gays for political gain. As I know it, some people are naturally attracted to the same sex. This is so, even in the animal kingdom. The view that being gay is a mental disease, has long been discarded by many countries and was popular in the 60s. We are now in 2012!
My proposal is that we approach an international organisation such as the UN on guidance of how to deal with this issue. This should be done with respect to our culture and norms. The gay issue has been discussed by many
Observer. Please note that Dr. Katele Kalumba was a Cabinet Minister in the Chiluba regime. He was Finance Minister. Please improve your observations.
if a monckey can never be born gay then it can not be natural for u to be gay.this is the sin that brought about the distruction of sodom
No.1 The Kimbanguist
Did you know that pre-colonial homosexuality existed in Africa way before the white man came to Africa? Get your facts right. Or may be just shut up.
Observer #2. A few questions: 1. Why (and what are the citations) was mental disease de-linked from homosexuality? 2. What social effects do homosexual animals have (e.g. bonobos do it to actually ATTRACT the opposite sex – not as a predominant habit, etc.). Lower animals have more purpose for it than humans… What do you have on this one? 3. Kalumba was an academic before he became a political ‘heavyweight in the government. Perhaps if you prod him he will give you the scientific evidence.
Remember there are what we call schools of thought. It is like religion; the one you favor most will give you all the truths you need.
I would like to know what papers Katele has published. Have they been on witchcraft or homosexuality? I am just wondering where he is coming from and what credentials he has in this area of human behaviour
May the Lord bless you for speaking against this abomination unlike the PF Govt who is mute and were only forced to speak angrily by an inquisitive reporter.source KT. Zambia belongs to Jesus.
May the Lord bless you for speaking against this abomination unlike the PF Govt who is mute and were only forced to speak angrily by an inquisitive reporter.source KT Zambia belongs to Jesus.
Therefore, I am presenting biblical truths with empirical facts that reinforce and confirm the values taught in God’s Word. I don’t have any delusions about this approach changing anyone who is closed-minded or wants to believe a lie because it’s convenient. I can t argue anyone into believing. But I do pray that true believers who have simply been misinformed or uninformed will prayerfully consider and acknowledge the timeless truths of God’s Word.
For instance, many people think that saying homosexuality is wrong, is hate speech and have therefore adopted a tolerance toward the whole issue. Aside from the obvious scriptural teaching that says homosexuality and lesbianism is sin, consider some of these facts: Homosexuals average living twenty years less than their heterosexual counterparts.1 THINK OF THAT! The government mandates that health warnings be put on cigarette packages, and smoking, on average, takes ten years off a person’s life
2 That means that on average, homosexuality reduces a person’s life 200 percent more than cigarette smoking. If there was any objectivity on this issue, people would speak out against homosexuality twice as much as they do against cigarettes.However, the homosexual community tries to portray their lifestyle as normal, like the traditional couple next door. That is an absolute lie. Statistics show that domestic violence among homosexuals is 300 times greater than traditional couples.3 Suicide is 200 percent greater, and depression among homosexuals is 50 percent greater than heterosexuals
Why do you think suicide and depression is higher in homosexuals?? It’s because there are people on this earth that beat, torment and even kill homosexuals! I’m sure many years ago depression was higher among the black race due to racism….it’s all thanks to discrimination. Let’s not pretend as though heterosexual relationships are flawless and without domestic violence, please!! How many Zambian households have a couple that are constantly at each others throats?? Let’s drop the hypocrisy all because we’re too afraid to let go of primitiveness.
.4 Some argue that these statistics are so high because homosexuals are denied acceptance in our culture. But look at societies like the Netherlands where homosexuality has been legalized for years. The rate of psychiatric illness is statistically similar to countries that haven’t granted this recognition to homosexuals.5 Therefore, that argument dies. In the states that have allowed homosexual marriages, such as Vermont, only about 25 percent of homosexuals have availed themselves of marriage.
I beg to differ from these learned individuals.Some people are born that way.I know one famous journalist who narrated how he has always been only been attracted to fellow men from his kindergarden years.He narrated how he had difficulties understanding his feelings throughout his formative years.Now can you say that he learnt about it as a child ? It were feelings he had to deal with…not a learning process.
And how can you say that he was born that way as if you are this journalist’s creator? You chose to believe your fellow being than believing God. What does the good book says about Sodom and Gomorrah? Read your bible and come back and continue this discussion.
6 Think about this—43 percent of homosexuals have had sex with 500 partners or more in their lifetimes. And 28 percent of homosexuals have had 1,000 or more sexual partners.7 That is HUGE! They aren’t moral people who want committed relationships. These statistics show that the majority of homosexuals are not “normal” by any measurement but their own. Their lifestyle is not only destructive to themselves but also to society.When the spiritual effects of homosexuality are factored in, this is one of the most destructive lifestyles possible.
dint know all that but well put hey…..
It’s not a hate crime to say homosexuality is wrong any more than it’s a hate crime to say smoking is hazardous to one’s health. It’s just the truth. If we truly loved those trapped in homosexuality, we would speak out on this issue. But those who are telling the truth have been branded as hate mongers when just the opposite is true. Those who endorse homosexuality are burying their heads in the sand of “political correctness” and encouraging destructive behavior.
Leviticus 19:17 says,“Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him.”It’s sin not to speak the truth to homosexuals. It’s not loving them. It’s loving ourselves and avoiding the persecution that will surely come our way for taking a stand.
Source Andrew Wommack Ministries USA.
Very soon we will say a law promoting or allowing a human being to have sex with a dog. We are committing a big sin in the eyes of God. What does the bible teach on homosexual?
Religion is nothing more than a scam.These leeches get to live off the sweat of working people by convincing them that their bullshit is the truth.There is no truth in religion.The bible is just a book of fairy tales, very poorly told,by greedy,unscrupulous villains who will do and say anything to get the good life for nothing.
Using religion to try to control other peoples lives and feelings is an abomination and should be condemned by all reasonable peoples.
Myles.
Good afternoon
As Africans, we are certainly living in interesting times. My only worry is whether we will manage to retain our African values, customs and traditions and pass them on to our future generations, as other nations have done or whether we will we be devoured by the influence of foreign lifestyle?
Fact is that every society needs traditions, customs and taboos to maintain order and to master it’s existence. Interestingly, smoking in public places is becoming a taboo in Europe. In Singapore, you will be presecuted for spitting in public. In our African society, people smoke and spit in public but it is taboo for a man to be with another man or a woman to be with another woman.
The two doctors said things with out scientific references, all they voiced is their opinions. First of all we all know that Kalumba is a witch doctor duh, the other one, we can question him, when did the two do a research to come up with what they just said. Can both of them tell me whey in their lives decided oh, I think i will be having sex with women, because they claim gays just wake up one morning, made up their mind i will be sleeping with fellow man
How ignorant! Yes people are born gay !
sexual differentiation occurs within the womb, as a result of hormonal influences, it has been hypothesized that homosexuality results from a differential hormone balance in the wombs of those who eventually exhibit a homosexual orientation. Accordingly, the researchers hypothesized that male homosexuals had less androgen exposure during development than male heterosexuals, while female homosexuals had greater steroid exposure during development than their heterosexual counterparts.
This means People are born gay!
Did you know Jesus never condemned gay people and never condemned gay partnerships?
Jesus affirmed gay people in Matthew 19:11-12.
Why are people so ignorant?
Thanks
Stop lying against the truth! Christ never affirmed any works of darkness! Homosexuality cannot be of God because God made man and woman to “be fruitful and multiply and to fill the earth”!
If you want to be respected in this debate, I urge you to bring your own arguments instead of misquoting or twisting scriptures because there are some who read and know the Scriptures more than you do. The behaviour of using the Bible to defend gayism is clearly evil and extremely ugly and I will not tolerate it. If it was’nt for the fact that I’m having a nice day, I would tell ou what I really think about you.
if i stand by your reasoning, homosexuals should be given hormonal therapy to rectify their disorders and not gay rights.
Whether or not someone is born homo, that still does not make it normal! Biologically, two people of the same gender cannot reproduce, so how will society grow if all men start copulating with men and women start copulating with women? It does’nt make sense!
If people want to be homo or lesbo, I have no problem with that but I certainly have a problem if our African society is forced to accept homosexuality as the norm! How can the Secretary General of the United Nations tell Zambians to do this?!!
SG asked Zambians to respect these people and give hem BASIC rights. He did not say that it should be accepted it as normal. We have disabled people and we respect them. But we do not regard it as normal
ba chale, to borrow your own words “stop misquoting and later on mislead the public by suggesting that SG was telling us to accept homosexuality” . he was merely telling us to respect people with different sexual orientation and to uphold their human rights. Besides, homosexuality is diferent from persons having a different sexual orientation.
#17 Mushota walasa apo, i do not know where you got your facts but I agree withg yoy on this one. Zambians do not understand this issue, no one would one day chose to be gay knowing the fact how a family in Zambia would excommunicate you or how society will treat you especially even on this blog, tell me who can choose to be homo. Kalumba chose to be a witch remember
Toyally agree with both Dr Kalumba and Dr manda’s views on the subject of gaysm. African and other developing countries like Zambians should understand this pyschological issue from their local setting as a society having existed since time imemorial. Societies have bequeched themselves with moral values held in high esteem as code of living and more than often linked to religious beliefs of rights and wrongs. These values have shaped our existence and continue to morph morally. The Western world and Britain in particular have lost their moral compass today and their families and identity has collapsed completely that a wrong is never identified different from a right. They now want to consider re-defining gaysm to be more acceptable than it is.
Please review your comments before posting. Every sentence has a mistake. This is gross
Good point Muna
thanks observer mwee,
i neaarly wanted to start looking for some interpretations
Ba Mushota, isaleni ichinwaa chanu Lekeni ukubosa.ni science nshi mwaishiba?
In their re-definition of homosexuality they propose to mean not only men marrying men or women marrying women but a man marrying one woman and woman at the same time. So is a woman to marry a man and a woman at the same time. It goes further that 3 men can be involved in a civil partinership as well as women. This just goes to show Zambians how abominable this is to our society and as Dr Kalumba states, homosexuality is a choice that people indulge themselves with for various perversive reasons. The West and Britain have lost it and are wollowing in the mere never ever to recover till judgement time. Lets be aware of this vice lest it engulfs us too.
Good point.
Polygamy exists in Zambia….albeit between a man and a woman. Some men are married to as many women as they want, and that truly is a choice. Very poor point.
Nine Chale 15, 18, you assertion are quiet frankly embarrassing and clueless, I don’t like saying this to anyone
I very often look forward to your read your interpretation of topics, but you either are saying what you are saying just because you like the reading of your own comment, or you quiet frankly clueless. I think It is the later and I look forward to reading more credible coherent comments from you
Poor effort, but I will not dessert you. Are you suggesting there is been a campaign to have people copulating with the same sex? What did you eat?
Repudiation when unwarranted often result people debunking you albeit it reluctantly so as in my case. You waste effort this year
Thanks
After misquoting the Bible, you’re now beginning to misrepresent me. I am willing to explain the issue to you more exclusively if you are earnestly interested in learning. However, if you’re simply judging this matter based on your feelings and not on truth, then there’s no need for me to break it down for you. We may be living on the same continent but our convictions must have been gained in different galaxies.
At least this is useful infor for one to make a decision. Homosexuality is a mental disorder because why should one penetrate the anus and have his penis deep into faeces, shit! Am already vomiting. Such act can be done by mental people.
Good point watch the video on you tube by Ugandan Pastors eat de poo poo very educative
Meant totally agree with both Dr Kalumba and Dr Manda opinions on homosexuality. Re-definition of proposed gaysm in Britain of one man marrying a woman and a man at the same time and one woman marrying another woman beside a man as well.
opposing this is IGNORANCE and need their head examined. Studies have been conducted which have proved that there are certain hormonal imbalances that sway human desires and behaviors to one side.
it is through DNA engineering for example Do people born using their left hand choose or people who grow taller than either of there parents, or eve albinos?
The same applies to being Homosexual, its a natural thing to the person it effects as no one I think would choose to be homosexuals them selves as no one chooses to get the abuse for being who they naturally are. For someone reason It will take generations to educate Africans to agree with that,like it did to stop you using your hand to eat food, although ignorant people still use hands to eat Nshima
Thanks
Be careful that you do not deliberately choose to be ignorant and misinform others. You would not have been born of two men, would you?
“Mushota” – is it true that you’re Mary Mulenga, born and bred in Matero, Lusaka. That photo is for your more “affluent” friend, Cynthia of Olympia, Lusaka. Just asking as some one seems to know your true identity …
#2, what references do you want? Do you want divine references or scientifically generated information? Can African scientists not originate information, and become the references themselves?
I find this tendency denigrating. Why is it that you black Africans are lending a hand to Westerners to claim superiority over everything? I once experienced this hegemony in a Christian learning institution in the West, when the faculty of the College I went to did not believe I could put together a thesis for my postgraduate degree, and thereby denying me progress.
Kalumba and Manda are qualified scientists who can be and are authorities in what they say, in this instance, on the matter at hand.
Man, I did not speak about race in my posting. I asked where they got this information from? Was it their own research? In this case they can give the title of this paper, if it has been published. Is it from another source? Which one? Or did they use witchcraft to generate the information? Did one of them have a dream and some spirits told him that being gay is a choice? I just want to know how he arrived at that conclusion before I accept it? Is that too much to ask? Why are you talking about race?
abominations will not be accepted in Zambia period.Everyone supporting these abominations the Lord will judge you if you do not repent.
Mushota is a gay. Hey Mushota don’t twist scriptures to justify your lifestyle. Katele and his friend are right. Hey Mushota as long as you are in your homo lifestyle, we will not allow you to come to Zambia freely because you will end up at Chibokaila.
There is a myth in some circles, that those people identified as eunuchs in scriptures were homosexuals. This idea is totally ridiculous, has no Biblical merit, and is based upon nothing but supposition. It is indeed astounding that any learned person could come to such a contrived or self-serving conclusion, based on the facts. Of course when you have people that are determined to base their interpretations on the social climate of the day or the imaginations of men’s hearts, it becomes quite understandable. Because then it is easy for people to formulate palatable conclusions and read any belief they want “into” the scriptures. But this is obviously a teaching that is not found in scripture, and any Theologian worth his salt can righteously come to no other conclusion.
I agree with you on this one. Jesus was talking about eunuchs not people that can fu#k. Eunuchs can not do anything!!
The word eunuch in the old testament is the Hebrew word [caric](pronounced saw-reece’), meaning to be castrated. And by extension it means to be celibate or figuratively to live unmarried. In practical application, Kings and Rulers would often use castrated men or eunuchs, as those who were charged with the management and care of women’s chambers. This was done for obvious reasons, since it would be impossible for them to have sexual relations with the women that were under their care. Thus they were the ideal guardians of harems and servants quarters. For this reason the word [caric] is also translated chamberlain in scripture. Because it illustrates those who were given charge of the bed chambers of women
It is so sad that people who are expects can have such a verge explanation of Homosexuality. I do not agree with there thoughts of Homosexuality. If people chose , How people would want to be associated with something that is so stigmatized . Those are some of the questions people should ask. I think for alot of people its not easy to be gay. Funny how people think of sex. But Being gay has very little to do with that. Whether we accept it or not. This is something that has been going on and will not stop because people are talking about it.
It does matter how much you sugar coat it. Gayism is worst than animals. Exterminate the rot before it gets rooted in our culture. Gayism is not welcome either in the west. Dont be cheated that people are born gay. What about paedophiles? are they born attracted to children and if so, are we going to legalise the rot. Please give me a break.
Yes Mr or Mrs Shy whatever the gender, murderers, prostitution, homosexuality, sodomy, defilement you can name the vices have been going on from time i dont know but they still remain vices. Are we going to legalsie them based on how long the wrong has been going on? Not really. If you are gay, all you need is treatment period.
Katele, you need yo redo your PHD.
I think on this issue mushota is right , with my little knowledge in psychology some people r born homosexual no way out. i wonder what kind of psychology katele and the friend did, they shuld nt mislead the society, such examples which they gave is nt suited in this new age. pliz go back n study yo materials
What a load of rubbish!
There is no evidence that this is a learned behaviour. I suppose Dr Kalumba is reading from 19th century textbooks since he has been in hiding in Nchelenge for 100 years. Wake up Dr Katele and read new SCIENTIFIC studies on this matter. As for the pretending Urologist Dr Manda, I just have to ask him to produce his post graduate diploma that qualifies him to be a Urologist, and not attendance certificates.
Dear The Saint, are you suggesting that there is scientific evidence to show that people who commit incest, bestiality, homosexuality and Paedophilia are born that way? Where is this evidence? Are you saying we should respect these acts?
An encouragement to my fellow believers, keep on praying in the Spirit at all times with kinds of prayers.These are all signs of the new world order and the signs of the end times. Anyone who opposes these abominations will be called a hater, anyonw who stands up and calls for righteousness will be called a hater.These are signs of the persecutions that will come upon everyone who stands up for righteousness.
Jesus has already overcome and he will come back to take his own before he destroys the world/earth just like in the days of Noah and Sodom and Gomorrah.Anyone who stands up for righteousness will not be liked because they do not belong to the world even Jesus was persecuted and he is still not liked in a lot of countries mentioning his name and preaching his word in public is offensive.
You can run on for a long time, but one day God is gonna cut you down. Invent and re-invent yourselves all you want, but the Almighty creator who changes not, will have the final say when judgement is set. Pretend you never heard His word, ignore it as much as you want, choose to be deliberately ignorant but the Ancient of days still loves you and wants to change before it is too late.
I like women because I am being raped by deonms? What I find deviant is that Christians believe that God would condemn people for love. If there is a God I do not believe he would condemn people for loving one another, I think he would be against the separatism and the judgments that should be left up to Him. And what about Orca whales? Would God destroy them as well?
MUSHOTA DO YOU JUST USE YOUR FOOT AND NOT THE HAND WHEN EATING? ACTUALLY USING OTHER TOOL FOR EATING IS NOT NATURAL. I WONDER IF YOU JUST PEAK YOUR FOOD WITH THE MOUTH LIKE A DOG AND NOT USING YOUR HAND. YOU THINK USING KNIVES IS BEING INTERLECTUAL?
And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.And such as do wickedly against the covenant shall he corrupt by flatteries: but the people that do know their God shall be strong, and do exploits.And they that understand among the people shall instruct many: yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many days.
Quote “Behavioural Scientist and sex therapist Katele Kalumba has said that homosexuality is a matter of choice because it is a learnt behaviour according to scientific research.”UNQUOTE
Please publish the references to the Research. Otherwise this is pure bullshit.
Now when they shall fall, they shall be holpen with a little help: but many shall cleave to them with flatteries.And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.
Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things.Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for gain
He shall stretch forth his hand also upon the countries: and the land of Egypt shall not escape.But he shall have power over the treasures of gold and of silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt: and the Libyans and the Ethiopians shall be at his steps.But tidings out of the east and out of the north shall trouble him: therefore he shall go forth with great fury to destroy, and utterly to make away many.And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him. Daniel 11:31-45
I am shocked that an experienced medical man like Dr Manda can express such unread ignorance. Sexual orientation is not a matter of choice. It has to do with complex biological factors. It is a natural inclination. Of course some people have been ‘forced’ to engage in it for other reasons like poverty or being confined with the same sex persons for a long time. But you cannot take away the fact that the feelings are naturally what they are. Gay persons have been known to get married and have children because of the pressures, stigma and societal social constructions – they don’t want to be ‘found out’ because they know what irrational and prejudiced treatment they will get – sometimes even killed..
The two doctors are absolutely correct. Homos are seriously ill mentally and need both professional and spiritual attention. If indeed they were born that way, then God would be unjust in punishing them for something they can scarcely control. Read Leviticus 20:13. The fact of the matter is that the practice of homosexuality is the greatest demonstration to God and mankind that you are irrevocably a Satanist. You have to be a Devil worshiper to adopt a lifestyle that is totally at odds with all that is good. Please, proponents of “homos were born that way”, stop slandering God who created all things perfect, read again Deuteronomy 32:4. The Bible says homosex is obscene and unnatural. You have got to be mentally twisted not to see that.
Dr Kalumba is Gay!
This a crap.I am very disappointed with the two.They shouldn`t substitute opinion for a fact.
To debate the point raised by Kalumba, one has to debate this topic based on NATURE VS NURTURE…once you bring religion into it you’ve strayed off, Zambians are too homophobic to debate this topic from the on set!!
All these people who quote the Bible remember the writers were not qualified medical practitioners. God didn’t write it. Get real
I am bored with this debate. You cannot debate with people who think that the bible is the word of God. It is pointless. Unfortunately, most Zambians are incapable of arguing without quoting the ‘good book’.
And all these people quoting the Bible – why does Zambia have one of the highest rates of HIV in the world? Is it because we follow the Bible and only ever jiggi-jiggi with our wives and nobody else? Nadabwa… Hypocrisy is also a sin
thats why a man shall leave his mother and father and join with his wife to make a home, the bible says. but why gay rights today?
Iye Ba Dr Manda! That explanation is nonsense. It doesn’t matter what the justification for homosexuality is, the bottom line is that Zambians won’t endorse the practice on religious grounds.
@53,54
Exactly reminds of the famous gay BBC radio 1 DJ Scott Mills documentary about homophobia in Uganda, when he told an anti-gay evangelist in Uganda that he was gay…the clergyman couldn’t believe him to point where he said he can cure him through worship…where do you start with such people??
If we created ourselves we would be at liberty to do as we pleased, but as it is we came with a manufacturers user guide as it were, with laws and regulations designed to enable us derive maximum pleasure out of life. You agree you have to be raging insane to pour orange juice where your car user manual says you should put engine oil. The same applies if a man’s ass evokes erotic feelings in you. Rush to see professionals for assistance. Trying to justify and rationalize homosexuality won’t make it normal and acceptable. It will forever remain an anomally, disgusting, filthy and unnatural. How is that so difficult to see?
this issue is rubbish and shouldn’t be debated in Zambia. fwabupuba
Ok, what is with this fear that societies will die out if gays are respected? I don’t understand this argument, and it is the most ignorant anyone can use in this debate. No one is saying that we should all become gays, all that is being asked is that we do not discriminate against them. But somehow, some people think gays will go on a rampage screwing every gay in sight. Homosexuality has been in existence for thousands of years. Look up the Greeks. They are very ambivalent towards the practice and they have not died out. As nauseous as the thought of two guys screwing makes me, I do not condemn the act because I am not affected with what two dudes get up to in the privacy of their homes. And for Manda to say it’s because of porn, really???
Quote: “…some people get into the practice of homosexuality because of Western influence, which they tend to feel is the modern way to live.”
Dr. Kalumba is right, “follow fashion” is a common practice among Africans. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not archaic and I’m not against learning new ways of improving our living conditions but I think that we need to be very careful about the things we choose in order to live “modern lives.” The thing is that even in the West, things are constantly changing and what is regarded to be “modern” and generally accepted today might suddenly turn out to be archaic and outlawed tomorrow. Scientists are always reversing their statements concerning global warming, carbon emissions etc.
You are clearly out of your depth on this topic…thinking homosexuality is western habit is utter ignorance!!
The problem with the homosexual debate is on two fronts. Those who simply want to go along with ‘cultural mob sentiments’, and those that turn a blind eye to scentific facts and seek solace in the bible – which has been a part of their diet since they were toddlers. If you read only what society has prescribed for you, without question and without the realisation that you need to broaden your knowledge horizons, you end up in this myopic quagmire where you fail to think and assess matters for yourself. A lot of you bloggers hence end up blabbing unconvincingly and unintelligently about matters you know little about. You need reality checks. It is pitiful that even the political leadership is caught up in the ignorance. Who is going to be a source of sober guidance for the misled?
Mushota, !!!! for Gods sake, stop misleading innocent SOULS /readers by quoting the word of God. In his comment Jesus was refering to marriage read the following scriptures: Marriage should be a deterrent to lustful sin and to unfaithfulness (1 Cor. 7:2). But a few either do not have normal sexual desires (they were born eunuchs or were castrated), or are able to control those desires for the furtherance of God’s program on the earth (Matt. 19:12; cf. 1 Cor. 7:7-8, 26). But not all are able to accept the single role (Matt. 19:11). Many marry and carry out God’s purposes, extending His work in the world.. no where did he refer to Homesexuals or gay or lesbians. You will be judged by misleading innocent souls. May you be delivered !!!!
# 2 pleae avoid pointing fingers at other people as you have done. If you know something, just state the facts as other people have done.Katele Kalmba, and Fancis Manda have just stated the facts they know about this topic under discussion and they havent talked about everything.I have respect for all the people who have talked about this but one thingis clear people who are made in the image of God are behaving differently. Animals are acting better than human beings because a male dog will ever climb on the ale dog. Its a wake up call to everyone that sin is real and people need Biblical Counselors to help them set their priorities right
The two good doctors need to make it clear that they are stating opinions. That is a good thing for an individual to maintain a position over something. However, their opinions are not FACTS. For them to be facts, it requires some supporting information, which they have not provided. If they are using the bible, that needs to be clarified in their statements. We can not have leaders that just wake up one day and say whatever comes to their mind. This country needs a lot of love to go around. We have problems with tribalism and other vices. These guys are pouring petrol to the flames by making careless statements. While I do not support the act of homosexuality, I think these people need our love and respect. I support what the SG said last week
contd.
An example: at one time in western history, it used to be normal for young girls to be married to older men. It was also once “modern” for men in Europe to have more than one wife. Today, both are outlawed as “paedophilia” and “polygamy” respectively.
So it might just turn out to be that when the West has finally saturrated it’s ego with homosexual and lesbian lifestyles, it will become outlawed (at the latest when they realise how destructive it is to their own future!) I wonder what next they will begin to practise? And they will begin to ask Africans to accept it and again we will have some Africans who will be eager to embrace their “modern” ways and follow them. And when ordinary Africans like you and me criticize their new ways, we shall be called “ignorant!”
Well spoken.
Gays and lebians are worse than DOGS. They need medical help
You people who support homo or is it gay rights, assuming that your parents were gay, would you be around to even right your nonsense on this page? Get real and ask God for your forgiveness of your sins because Hell awaits you.
There are good doctors, those who know their s**t and there are stupid doctors, those who don’t know their s**t; Dr Kalumbu is clearly a stupid doctor! Modern science clearly says people ARE born gay and they break it down to something as simple as some people naturally like chocolate & some people don’t! You cant force someone to like chocolate if naturally dont! Ugh!! The Medical Boards should yank his medical license for purporting such trash!
I KNOW DR. MANDA ONLY SUPPORTS SATA…..HE IS A HOMOSEXUAL AND SODOMIST TOO. SATA WILL MARRY KABIMBA FIRST AND WE WILL ALL BE THERE AT THE INDEPENDENCE STADIUM……………..
To all advocate of homosexuality on this blog, are you suggesting that there is scientific evidence to show that people who commit incest, bestiality, homosexuality and Paedophilia are born that way? Where is this evidence? Are you saying we should respect these acts because we are in 2012?
Mushota, Jesus was talking about a totally different group here!!!
A eunuch is very different from a gay person.A gay person has sexual feelings for another where as the eunuch may have been castrated or has no desires whatsoever.Search the word eunuch it might help.
And for all you guys calling the above doctors stupid,firstly doctors usually disagree.It is a well known fact for people who are well learned in disciplines like medicine or law to disagree.I belong to one of them so I know.
This has nothing to do with supporting or not supporting homosexuality. It has to do with accepting its existence and the reasons thereof. It has always been there – in any community of the world. I am disappointed that people like ‘Nine Chale’ assume that it is a western invention that is being imposed on some supposedly purist African values and culture. Your stance is immediately defeated by the fact homosexuality is biologically constructed, a consequence of the existence of human sexual variations that are natural. Burying your head in the bible or perceived ‘normal’ African values and cultures, shows you are not ready to wriggle out of your shell and explore other realistic existencies.
well spoken. I hope many pipo get to read yo comments.
England is the most shameful country in the world because they are ruled by the Anglican church which promotes faggotism. God has punnished the UK and the only products they export are the English Premier League and Education. They need the US to remain relevant!
I didn’t know England was ruled by the Anglican Church!!
If people were to be born that way, wouldn’t it mean there are such genes that would be passed from parent to off-spring? But the last time I checked, homosexuals do not and cannot reproduce. Hello somebody!
Dear Harod Muna#73. I like your effort to stay rational in this subject. But then you shoot yourself in the foot when you say it is a natural act. The fact is it is not a natural act which we should be compelled to respect and treat differently any more than we treat incest, paedophilia an bestiality, because people are not born that way. Where is this scientific evidence that supports any of these acts as in-born and not acquired long after birth?
Are People Born Gay?
The Biological Basis for Sexual Orientation
By Rich Deem
Ask a lesbian or homosexual why they are that way.
Like a womaniser (cheater) ask him why he can’t stay with one woman
Nurture vs Nature or Nature vs Nurture
or is homosexuality an evil breed of evil. Sodom and Gomorrah!
Before Sodom and Gomorrah?
natwitabile mulopwe…kalombo mwane
I love reading about deep, dark, mysterious, blinded by the bible Africa. First… this is a university trained man…. no wonder qualifications gained in Africa arent recognised anywhere else.
Second, to the bible bashers….. when is the first execution of the women not virgins wanting to marry??? (Deuteronmy) Divorce is outlawed and NEVER occurs? (Matthew) You have never had a haircut, a tattoo, worn a garment of mixed fabric, kicked a football? (Leviticus… same book as your favourite quote). STOP quoting one part of the bible, and ignoring the rest… you are all hypocrites if you do..
And if homosexuality is a choice…… that means this man thought about it, tried it, and decided against it??? FFS… grow up!
Brabus, my point is that of one’s initial sexual orientation, which for the most, one can’t do anything about. After that, anything else people commit sexually has to do with sexual deviation, not orientation. That is why even people who are supposedly ‘normal’, in the sense that they practice ‘ordained’ heterosexual sex, have committed the most hideous and outrageous sexual acts on children or fellow adults. What you are naturally, is one thing, what you choose to do after, is another issue.
The question of how homosexual orientation originates has been the subject of much press, with the general impression being promoted that homosexuality is largely a matter of genes, rather than environmental factors. However, if one examines the scientific literature, one finds that it’s not quite as clear as the news bytes would suggest. The early studies that reported differences in the brains of homosexuals were complicated by HIV infection and were not substantiated by larger, better controlled studies. Numerous studies reported that possible hormonal differences affected homosexual orientation.
However, these studies were often directly contradictory, and never actually measured any hormone levels, but just used proxies for hormonal influences, without direct evidence that the proxies were actually indicative of true hormone levels or imbalances. Twin studies showed that there likely are genetic influences for homosexuality, although similar studies have shown some genetic influences for homophobia and even opposition to abortion. Early childhood abuse has been associated with homosexuality, but, at most, only explains about 10% of those who express a homosexual orientation. The fact that sexual orientation is not constant for many individuals, but can change over time suggests that at least part of sexual orientation is actually sexual preference.
Attempts to find a “gay gene” have never identified any gene or gene product that is actually associated with homosexual orientation, with studies failing to confirm early suggestions of linkage of homosexuality to region Xq28 on the X chromosome. The question of genetic influences on sexual orientation could be definitively answered by using DNA microarray technology, although, to my knowledge, no such studies are planned or in progress.
Thank you class see you next week!!
By the way It always amazes me when people say that they were born gay. Looking back on my own experience, I would never say that I was “born straight.” I really didn’t have any interest in females until about the seventh grade. Before that time, they weren’t really interesting, since they weren’t interested in sports or riding bikes or wire cars or killing lizards or anything else I liked to do.
Till next time class!!
“….exposure to pornographic material or peer pressure” hahahaha this is so funny coming from an educated person. Honestly!
Prof Jack Daniels, that is a poignant discussion you have brought up (I know some of your students will challenge you for a citation right here even when their little fingers can type Google!). Bloggers refuse to watch things like wildlife researched movies and to read material on diversity that is why their views are parochially steeped in their religious beliefs. There is so much evidence of homosexuality in animals, birds and even fish but people are choosing to ignore that fact. Some behaviours are done for purposeful ends, others are done for domination reasons. I am sure I will be asked for a citation. Come and help yourselves to my BBC wildlife and National Geographic materials, or just GOogle!!!!!!!
Some *****s commenting on this article. Dont you know that KaTELE is a qualified Doctor… who studied what he is talking about. Does he need to be white to talk sense. Inferiority complex…. chimbwii
@The Kimbanguist
You sound like a shitted mongolian .Why is there no gays in Kuwait ,UAE,Syria.Why is there no gays in china .Come to me .i will pump hot chakalaka in ur stnknnnnnn okavango
For your information….i happen to know a few chinese gays & lesbians. There is a difference between non-existence and lack of knowledge of existence.
Thanks Dokota
Any behaviour is learnt,any character is genetic.Homosex is a behiour ,any gay would tell you he harmered a girl first ,Why then didnt u hit your fellow man first.Dont bring that shhhhhhht in zambia .We are zambians and not europeans……….
arrest these chaps in Zambia..why should they lie that they are born homos..?
LusakaTimes you have yanked my article off your site with a link to a Timeslive account on homo women fighting over adoption after one renounced her homosexual behaviour! No wonder Observer thinks we are not providing citations – OR ARE YOU TRYING TO USE THAT ARTICLE AS YOUR OWN!!!???? ATASE!
The article you are talking about does not seem to be a published paper or report. You can not take a news item and use it as proof. Didn’t your teachers teach you how to get information? I can give you some lessons but it will cost you :-)
What are the rules here? I have ignored this behavior enough! I want to continue contributing but am getting more and more disgusted! Are we not allowed to provide links in our arguments or what? A link simply points a reader to the site where the article is – we are not plagiarising! WE ARE BLOGGING and trying to share discoveries to backup our arguments!!! FGSGU!!!!!!!
Mr Editor don’t behave like a UNIP cadre in the UDI period where suspicion extended to insects, trees and new models of cars!!! This is the 21st Century! GUFs!!!
I am outa here – signed off!!!!
Does katele have evidence to prove his claims??? if not, he is talking absolute rubbish!! people are born gay – similarly, Katele was born a thief!!!!
Read Romans 1:18-27 u see that homosex sin condemed by God
Even the ‘civilised’ British are fighting homosexuality and civil partnerships, so who are they to impose this on us africans when their own do not accept this immoral act.., Adam and Eve and not Adam and Steve..,They can change the laws but can’t change the mindset of the people, its the same all over the world..
No to Homosexuals ……… yes they have been around for ages , but so too have have murderers and rapists. We should realy feel sorry for them, not encourage and legitimise them . Unfortunately they do spread physical diseases ( venereal and HIV ) and cause mental and moral distress both to others and to themselves.
Our Two leanered Doctors are RIGHT.
Ba Kalok, were you born from the anus? i think mwana balikunya iwe. should you delve deep beyond animal thinking, no wonder your link is being trashed. Any support for what is wrong regardless of how educated or schooled one is is in itself a denial of humanity. What makes humans, humans and not humans, dogs? Yes according to animal biology, we are classified as animals but please there are classes, genuses or phyla which implies even if a chimp may somehow walk on two, it remains a chimp and this is the weakest point of evolutional biology, total failure to make a link or indeed find the much coveted missing link between chimps and man. All those busy yapping about gay rights, think for a moment, had your father decided to ejaculate that golden sperm in some boys anus, will you be here?
Chimbwi very correct, these father f*^&kers casue distress among themselves andd the rest of humanity. People also read Monitors comments, these chaps are the most vulnerable when ity comes to suicides and an diseases etc. These chaps want to claim they were born that way … hel no that is a behaviour they learnt. 99% of these chaps started heterosexual then along the way decided to experiment. then all hell broke loose.
There is a mounting body of evidence that points a finger at pollution in our food and water as having an effect on the hormone inbalance in unborn babies. Scientists point to the large number of fish that have both male and female sexual organs, living near sewer pipes that pour into seas from major western cities. Some pipo are born in worng bodies.
Even GBMs doughter is a practicing Homo living with her partner.
I have come across similar information as well. In that case it seems the sexuality is determined in the womb. There have also been cases of twins having different sexual orientations. Interesting
I would like Zambia to learn from Zimbabwe and Uganda how to deal with this vice fullstop!
Those supporting Homosexuality using science please give us the references of the studies you are referring to so that we show you other studies proving the opposite,
what the hell is a …”psychologist-cum-sex therapist” …?
LT post me the full copy of Dr.Rodger Chongwe report so that I get informed.Why is it that Postnewspaper is releasing bits and pieces of the same and claiming its confidential.I feel mis-informed by this state of affairs.Please find and post that report.I can not trust the para-phrased Postnewspaper versions
Some of the above bloggers above do not belong on this forum because they are here to insult. This is an intellectual discussion about homosexuality but they are busy with their insults as usual. I hope those insults take you far in life, but leave them in your brain for now
homosexual my ass, what utter nonsense
How can Drs. Kalumba and Manda be considered to be respected doctors when they spout such ignorant bullshit as this.
One believes that homosexuality is not natural and the other that it is caused by people viewing pornography.
Over 3000 species of animals exhibit homosexual behaviour.Man is not alone in this regard.
There have always been homosexuals in every society and there will always be.
Claiming that your ignorance and lies are the truth is shameful.
You should be stripped of your titles and thrown in jail for spreading this bullshit.That you try to mislead people by perpetuating lies as truth is disgusting.
Get real,tell the truth for a change.
Myles.